Love, Humanity & Healing The Inner Child with NUMA

Jennifer Norman:
I believe music does so much more than just move your body. I believe it can actually heal your spirit. And my guest today is case in point. Numa is a powerhouse of creativity and compassion. A singer, songwriter, producer, TV commentator and humanitarian. Known across Europe and beyond as the Self Empowerment Singer, her art transcends genre and language, weaving together music, inspiration and social activism into a living expression of purpose. With 17 singles, 22 music videos and collaborations with icons like Trevor Horne, Peter Gordeno of Depeche Mode, Alan Clark and her husband Phil Palmer of Dire Straits, Numa's career reads like a symphony of artistic mastery and soul evolution. She's also an international Louise Hay Heal Your Life teacher and global ambassador supported by UNICEF, blending energy, healing and humanitarian outreach into her creative mission.

Jennifer Norman:
In this episode we'll explore how Numa uses music as a force for transformation and self realization. We'll talk about her incredible career, the meaning behind her global humanitarian work, and how she helped others unlock their light through sight, sound, intention and love. If you've ever needed a reminder that music can awaken the world, stay tuned. This conversation will uplift your heart, your purpose and maybe even your frequency. Now let's get ready for the one, the only Numa. Hi there Numa. Welcome to The Human Beauty Movement Podcast.

Numa:
Jennifer, I'm in love with you. I'm in love with you.

Jennifer Norman:
I am in love with you too girlfriend.

Numa:
Honestly, what a beautiful energy. You're fantastic. You're lovely.

Jennifer Norman:
You just radiate cosmic feminine energy and I am just so delighted that we can have this conversation. You've been called the Self Empowerment Singer. I would love for you to share how that title came about and how you define your mission as an artist.

Numa:
It's a lovely question because probably takes the global meaning of my life. Yeah when we're just defining 'self empowerment woman', which I find fantastic because you know that is, everything's happening in my life. Everything, achievement, any change, any struggle beyond and I took over. It's because I really deleted myself to recreate myself, reborn from myself, and forgive myself before I do anything outside myself. Before to judge or before be angry with someone else, before to give the the good publicity to someone else. I've been working so hard for all my long life. Long on myself, because I believe in karma, you know what I mean, that we're born with a mission and gradually, more you grow up, more you become conscious of what is your mission. You understand which is your mission actually. So you understand your path and so you understand that some choices and some things happen to you, happen for you and not against you. It takes a while to understand that.

Numa:
But we understand that is a key to overcome any particular kind of problems. So once you understand also to be an artist, which means you want to be... You feel this creativity exploding in your heart. You feel that you want to go deeper, that you want to touch people heartily. You want to make a change, you want to get create an impact for the world and better. And this comes from your creativity. Which way are you going to do it? I'm a doctor? No, I'm a lawyer? No.

Numa:
I mean, many people impact in an amazing way the world in many, many other ways. Of course, not in my case. I mean, I was just a little, little girl already singing, dancing. Trying to make people laugh. Trying to make them smile, laugh, smile. Try to make people happy, heal the little stress. Because we were kids, you see, I had problem with my mom, my brother and all. I was already there.

Numa:
Try to help them, to entertain them, to make them smile. So you start to understand who you are from yourself, from your action, from your inner dialogue and what happened. Also your life starts to give you a lot of lessons. Like in my case, I had a father that abandoned me immediately when I was born. It was a difficult path with my father - judgmental, always with the finger pointing against me. Telling me that I was worth nothing, I would never succeed. My parents split it immediately.

Numa:
So I grew up just with my grandmother. So I was missing my mother too immensely. Even if my mother was close by me. But she was too young to really, really, really support this child. Already very different from other child. So many problems at school. Because nobody wants to sit with me in the same desk, you know what I mean? The same table. Because I was strange.

Numa:
Because I was the one that was singing and dancing in the middle of the room. No, already talking...I was talking about UFOs, because I was already channeling. So, having all kinds of spiritual experiences. Imagine a girl, 7, 8, 9 years old. People say, oh whatever, you are new, or you have to stay far from me, you know, like so I didn't have any boyfriend. Nobody wants to be with me, of course, who would want to date a girl like that? I mean, it was just a weirdo, because I was singing, dancing, composing, talking about UFOs, having my spiritual connection, having angels talking to me.

Numa:
Nobody wants to date a girl like that. So I mean, I had a difficult childhood and I have a difficult love life, a sentimental life. Because I didn't find, nobody really loved me, really wanted me, and so I've been through a lot. I can tell you maybe one day when we have the time we can share proper experience. That in case, I will reveal just and only for the pleasure to give to the people the solution if they have this my same struggle I had. I can tell them how I went beyond, that I overcome that final loneliness or desperation in me. Because when you're kid you start to have some issues.

Numa:
Because... maybe the word is in English not correct. When you have some dysfunctional...when you eat too much or you're going on obesity. Are you saying English?

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah, like an eating disorder.

Numa:
Dysfunction, yes, an eating disorder. I start to have a terrible eating disorder. So, getting so fat then getting so thin. So I was, I was dancer. And everybody told me that I was too big. You know what I mean? So I was feeling ashamed because my body was never the right one. Feel me ugly.

Numa:
And then you eat even more. And then it become a terrible time. We accept to have a lot of... a lot of time, a lot of problems. A lot of those hurts. So. You die, or you are reborn.

Numa:
Or you want to learn, or you want to forgive, or you want to understand how life works. How life can be instead full of love and compassion and how to connect to the universe. How can you connect you to your real purpose if you're able to survive? Because we start to speak with your inner child every single day. You start to say to yourself, where am I? Who really, am I worth it? Am I worth a lot? Life does love me. You start to really feel life does love you. And full of chance...And you have a lot of reasons to be grateful, full of gratitude.

Numa:
And you start to understand even if your parents, If they do something, if they do something they're doing it to you because in their own way they have their own struggle. And they're learning together with you. They are kind of your teachers. And sometimes life teaches. Not always in a simple way.

Numa:
And then I became Buddhist. So I start to understand karma. I understand that everything is the sparkle and the cause. It's inside us. As if you work in your inner power. And we connect with the power of the universe. Really everything starts to go in the right direction. Otherwise we fight against ourselves.

Numa:
Then we fight against the world. And then we create resistance. And we don't... And we don't go nowhere, just blocks. So then I met also Joe Dispenza. And then I met Louise Hay, You Can Heal Your Life. Then I met a lot of teachers, Wayne Dyer, and I start with Buddhist monks, then amazing teachers, then become teacher myself, coaching myself.

Numa:
I have a lot of people that comes to me to find their own inner balance, emotional balance, to find their own power, their own talents to really heal very quickly, their own inner sabotage and change their life. So you see, I already told in a few minutes how my life began and in a difficult way because I was different and I now I feel special. And all of you are special guys, you know that. All of you are special. We're all special.

Jennifer Norman:
Yes. Thank you so much for sharing all of that. It's so interesting to see the arc of your life and how we do feel like misfits when we are young, but that becomes our superpower when we get older, if we can accept that. And a lot of that learning is that self acceptance and that belief in ourselves to the point that you were stating early on is that you believed in yourself. And sometimes that's really eventually. Yeah, eventually is like it takes a while to get there. But that is really the becoming is the knowing that all of these things that made you strange and made other people judge you or make you not want to fit in, helped you to stand out in a beautiful way. And you had all these extraordinary gifts and at such an early age.

Jennifer Norman:
It blows my mind. Seven years old, you're already like, you know, talking about UFOs and the cosmos and all of that. I love that. But it just speaks to so wildly to the calling that you have had in your life and how you've been able to find these other teachers that aligns with your message of we are one. That's the whole idea of Buddhism is the simplicity and the beauty of self realization, self actualization to help everybody else.

Numa:
Because this self, self, self, self means that then you devote all your energy to help the others. But if you don't heal yourself, how can you teach the other? How real. So it's nothing to do with selfishness or you know, just self realization and the rest of the world, who cares? It's the opposite. Because you really want to make the rest of the world happy as much as you are. You want to really share, you want to, you feel to be one. You don't feel separation anymore because that the greatest lies that we live in this, in this world is the separation. They are there, we are here. You know, physical distances, even though physical tell us that doesn't exist.

Numa:
Because the, the here and now is the same in any place in the world that we just, we communicate in the same terms. And so the distance is a lie, It's a delusion.

Jennifer Norman:
Right.

Numa:
And the separation and the person... that one, that population is horrible. I hate them, to do with us. That guy's black, that guy's yellow, that's the guy... I don't know. He's nothing to do with me. And this is the greatest delusion that the human being can have. And also another incredible delusion is that when people say, okay, however, there's nothing that I can do. It's too big than me. It's bigger than me. Right?

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Numa:
And it's another incredible misunderstanding that we had in. Because it's not banal. I mean the way to say banal, I would say that it's true is super true that we are drops of an immense ocean. And any drops has the same chemical, same power, same everything or the rest of the ocean. Right? Which means that when we work very well for our job, Drop, drop, drop, drop, drop, drop, drop. We are powerful like an entire ocean. So the delusion and misunderstanding. Think, what I can do in my little drop? Nothing.

Numa:
But you had no idea your job is half a job. If it's your... The circle of the love, the circle of the forgiveness, the circle of that. That you simply give the food to the cat in front of your door. That you don't say swearing to the guy that cut you off on the road with a car. You're helping the little lady with the super heavy bags after the supermarket. And you help her to cross the road.

Numa:
Yes, like a very, very good boy scout. Like a good human being, like a compassion human being. Your drop becomes so healthy that it starts to affect this drop, this drop, this drop, this drop. And that this ocean will become a completely different ocean. So people think that - what I can do with my own drops? Start with your own drops. Making a healthy, beautiful, immense, compassionate drop. And I promise you, bubbles, I promise you that all these drops will change the world.

Numa:
Because we can change the world. Started just not only from us, we can do nothing without it with other people. We can do everything for ourselves.

Jennifer Norman:
Oh, what a beautiful message. Yes. And it reminds me so much a lot of the work that I do because I work a lot with like people who believe that they've been marginalized or overlooked. Diversity type work. And one of my favorite quotes from Rumi is, you are not a drop in the ocean, you are the ocean in a drop. And so it is this mindset shift of power rather than powerlessness and hopelessness. You are hope. You are the thing that if you were to focus on your light and your energy, then you catalyze that change outside.

Jennifer Norman:
One of the most beautiful things Abraham Hicks says is like, no one needs to change the world. You don't go out thinking that you want to change the world, Change yourself, and then the world will change. And so. And that's all that we can do. And truly, that's the most powerful thing we can do, is to have that belief in ourselves, to live so often authentically, just as you're such a pure, beautiful example of Numa, to be able to just radiate this love and this light so that other people can be like, inspired to also live as authentically and as purely. And that's the way that change happens. It's not by forcing. It's not by the 'us versus them'.

Jennifer Norman:
And I see that a lot in like, self improvement and empowerment. People will often say like, well, those people are. Or they are like, or most people are. It's like, no, that's actually, you're speaking about yourself when you're talking about those other people. You're talking about a part of yourself that you don't really like or align with. And you want to try to change or to metamorphize into something better, to something that is, that is more profound.

Jennifer Norman:
And so let us all recognize all of the healing that we ourselves must do in order to be able to have a greater impact, a much more positive impact on the world.

Numa:
You speak in my language. And that's why I loved you at first sight.

Jennifer Norman:
Subscribe right now for more soulful stories and inspiring conversations with me and The Human Beauty Movement Podcast.

Numa:
And also, it's an endless conversation that I hope that people will stay with us and with the interest and also with an open heart and open mind, because I know that if guys that you listen to us now. It's sometimes more complex than that because we understand there are some people that really make our life very difficult and can be bad, nasty towards us. And it's true, it's not a lie. So we say, sorry, but I'm not like that. So thank you. We all the same, we love each other, blah, blah, blah. But I'm not like that. We don't say that we are all the same, which means that we are like a photocopy on each other.

Numa:
We are all different than God and we all have our own power and our own kind of... We say we can make our own choices. So we take the responsibility of what we say, what we do, and what kind of action we take, okay. But we need to understand that people that really make our life difficult, they have anyway some connection with us. If unfortunately, unfortunately they are on our path and we need to understand why. So when I met someone that thanks God rarely thanks God really more when I was younger now much, much rarely didn't like me. They was not, they didn't.

Numa:
They was not kind to me, honestly, very aggressive, very sabotaging towards me. And I did really, it's true. And I tell you with the hand on my heart, I really opened my arms to them because I thought to myself, what is that? It's fear.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Numa:
What kind of mirror and mirroring I'm doing towards them. What part of them I maybe mirror that they don't like it or they're scared about it or they think they would never achieve. So you better kill something that you think can be too much for you. Better that I kill it. I mean I destroy it. Because I think that I can never achieve it. And make understand that I will be never the enemy. I will be never against them.

Numa:
I will never betray their trust. I would never speak bad behind them. Even if I say they don't speak well behind me. I will never do that because that's not the way to solve this the problem. It's not the way to heal. The heal is when you open your arms even when it's difficult. Because I know I'm not saint. I'm not saint.

Numa:
I'm not, you know. No, no, no, no, no, no. Because not that I'm not super good. Oh my God much I good? No. I really want to heal my life. I really want to find a way to survive in this world. And even more to survive, thrive on this world.

Numa:
And to do that I cannot fight against everybody. I cannot stay there and say you ugly, you're bad. You don't. I don't like you. You told, you'll be speaking bad about me. Because all my energy will go away from what I need to do. And I need to make a change every single day.

Numa:
I need to make the difference every day. Which means I have to wake up in the morning and say what I can do good to that what I can which I can express myself. I can take over this problem. I need to use my energy for the good to do better and become a better person. So more you take away energy to the outside, the more you put inside you the energy and more you become powerful and more you can achieve your all your goals that you taught and expand your talents. So it's not better to be super, super saint. It's better to be wise which is something different.

Jennifer Norman:
And wisdom comes with experience, goes through. It does. It does go through. Like I love how you're like I'm not a saint. We're all sinners and we're all saints though, aren't we?

Numa:
No. You know, otherwise, you know, I'm so good. I forgive everybody. Don't get angry. I don't have an enemy. It's just a different way to deal with. I ask to myself these guys are not on my path. Why.

Numa:
Why is I'm struggling with this person that maybe is not kind to me. What part of me is resonating with these things and so I have to heal immediately. I have to clean immediately. So will go away. So will go away. And this honestly more that I go ahead the more happen very quickly and very gently, very smoothly because once again I really focus to be a better person before to stay there with the finger points and take what what is not with me a nice person. And also by coaching, I mean doing this coaching that I coach the emotional imbalance once again I coach how to discover our inner talents, how overcome our self sabotages. I would really also take over the traumas because I had plenty.

Numa:
So I finally know how to do that. And the music help and in case now we're going to talk also about how to do with the music but we can do also with the love, with the sharing, with the communication and with the trust. And so I can see people that are doing this lesson session with me that day by day, day by day I can tell you they open their heart, they put. They spread their wings. They really like it. They start to. They finally allow themselves to be happy, to breathe. They give themselves the permission to be thyself and from there they just beautiful star pot and never go back anymore.

Numa:
And see it's beautiful, beautiful transformation. And that's the love and the compassion of the toolkit.

Jennifer Norman:
Isn't that just awe inspiring when you can witness that? When you see literally the straight jacket loosening and falling off. People like people are so. Their lives constrict them so much that they feel trapped in their own time. All of a sudden they realize no, this isn't the way that I want my life to be. I do have the choice. I have freedom and I have agency to live without all of these shackles, without all of this baggage, without all of the heaviness and drama. It's just up to me and the way that I think about things wild.

Numa:
Yes, because in the mindset for who listen to us and maybe wants to reach me and wants to ask me and I would be really honored if you want to reach me and ask me personally something more, more deeper than that. I mean, I want to say there is a mindset because I understand you that listen to us, the property. Maybe you have five children, or maybe you don't have a pen in your bank account, or maybe you have been just fired from your own work. I mean, life is stuck. Believe me, you talking with someone and been through everything. Money struggles, health struggles, family struggles. So don't think, don't take me wrong, I know exactly what's going on. But when you start off with the mindset and the heartset mean the way that you start to recombine, reconnect your heart and your mind, which means once I said once again, self acceptance, self forgiveness, forgiveness to everybody.

Numa:
Because if you anger to your pain in your past, you will never have a future. You will never. You can make this quantum jump. It's impossible. So there are some specific technique, modern technique, because our proper spiritual law, law, universe, but let's call technique but spiritual law mean the universe works in certain ways. And then I can promise you five children, no job, no money. This kind of new energy attract, attract in the physical dimension, the third dimension, because we have 5, 6, 7, 10 dimension. But in this dimension attract physically, concretely.

Numa:
It's combination that you call something that happened by accident. Nothing, nothing happened by accident. It's not coincidence.

Jennifer Norman:
Like coincidence.

Numa:
Yeah, doesn't exist, coincidence, you know, and then you. And then you say, oh, wait a moment, this school's come from. Oh my God. This is. How possible. I just went down to the street and I met the guy offer me a job. How? Because your energy's changed.

Numa:
So if you want to know about, you can. You can meet me. I mean Instagram if you want. Just. You can write me in DM, I'm Numa Palmer, and come to talk to me, that I promise you that your life is about to change. I promise you on my heart.

Jennifer Norman:
Oh, thank you so much, Numa, for that invitation to our listeners. I would love to talk about your music. Number one, you've got a hit out, which is in... It's all about the feminine energy - "You Drive Me Crazy". And you've done it bilingual. Yeah, you've done it bilingually in Spanish as well as in Italian. So I think sometimes people take things for a little bit for granted and they're like, oh, this is a superficial kind of pop song and all of that.

Jennifer Norman:
And they don't realize, like the real, like deep person that you are behind all of that. So I just wanted to talk about, I guess, the journey of your music career, because I believe you started in about 2014 with your first single. Something like that?

Numa:
Yeah.

Jennifer Norman:
And so it's been like 11 years, which is really exciting. Tell us about how it started. And I know that you were singing and dancing and doing all this fun stuff when you were young, but then all of a sudden you decided, hey, let me do some professional recording.

Numa:
Yes, of course. Because I mean, I've been. I mean, I don't want to start for too long ago because otherwise we need three days. But how long you have, how many days? Ready, popcorn and Coca Cola. Wait three days here. But just take for granted when I tell you that I did a lot, a lot, a lot of work. Just take this for granted. Trust me, I started when it wasn't the girls, theater, teaching, dancing at schools in America, everywhere, studying, rehearsing, stages, everything.

Numa:
So I worked so much. And remember that I had a father every day telling me that was not worth nothing and I will never succeed. Remember this little, little, little details that I give you, which is not happy.

Jennifer Norman:
Decades and decades of hardship and failure to become the overnight sensation that a lot of people see.

Numa:
Yeah. So it's not, you know, when every day, what are you doing for? You're not good. You're not, you know, beautiful, you're not good. You're never fantastic. Especially when you don't know nobody. Nobody. You don't go compromise, you don't do nothing. You don't have money, so you cannot buy nothing.

Numa:
You cannot go in a bed with nobody, you cannot do nothing. You just, you want to do it because you want to do it in a clean and pure way. So it's super complicated, I promise you. So say that. So take. When I was just 20, 21, I was already doing some more and more professional things. And I tell you what, I got pregnant. I wanted to become pregnant. I wanted.

Numa:
So I had a child very, very early, which means another complication. Because when you have a little, little girl, you're a little girl, you have to grow enough together so you cannot travel anymore like you do before. You cannot do whatever you want. So you have a money issue, you have a school issue, you have the little girl that you need to feed and grow. And so which means that no sleep whatsoever, because I was singing, running back... I mean, six o' clock in, in the evening, not sleep. Take my daughter to school and use the money that was earning to. I don't know, to dress and clean my daughter.

Numa:
So I was. Ah. But even though I was keeping, keeping, keeping, keeping writing songs in the beginning I was a ghost writer. I tell you. There was. The record company was telling me because I was a good, we say good pencil, writing good things. I was writing for other people, lyrics, music and all of that.

Numa:
Then. And then finally, finally, finally start to produce. I start to write very important singers because they love my words, they love my spirit. You used to come to listen to me when I was singing live, say this girl is doing well, has a nice voice, has nice delivering, has nice messages. Because I was singing my own songs and also copied songs. And then I was already dancer because I've been dancing in America for a long time. Because before my bigger passion was the dancer, then I was an actress too. So I did a lot of theater.

Numa:
So I was honestly prepared. I mean I was prepared myself. Okay. A lot of training, a lot of work.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Numa:
So. And. And also challenged me. You know, More was difficult, more was scary and mostly to myself. I want to try this. I want to try this. And you know when you fall and stand out, you fall and stand up. You make mistakes and you want to learn.

Numa:
No, it's not good enough. No it's not good enough. I want to try again. No, this is that. And then, and then, and then I also be surrounding myself with people much, much more good than me. So I was going stay hours and hours in the session and we keep huge people super famous, super good. They were super. I was just a beginner and I was there hours and hours and hours and hours.

Numa:
Sight. Mute. To me, you know, learning, learning, learning, processing, processing, watching, watching, learning hours in my life and. But in my, my heart and my brain was really doing because probably I had a talent. So I had the istruments inside myself to know what to do which was I was learning okay. But I was really, really like this to more. They were good and more I was, I was there mute, you know what I mean? Just to do eating, breathing their air. So learning, learning, learning. So that. That's why I start to challenge myself to really to propose to... To work with people much more famous than me and say hey, it's a song.

Numa:
This is my way to produce, this is my way to write. This is my way to perform. And. And I start also with my own the records and my own songs and my own video on my own. I decided that that was producer on myself. I decided that was the entrepreneurs on myself. I decided that was a record company on myself.

Numa:
Started from zero zero money. Zero zero people helped me. Zero zero. Just zero. Just pushing myself, risking everything, my underwear. You know what I mean? Risking everything. Okay. Risking everything.

Numa:
And I'll just say no because this is. This is not my call. This is my call. This when I feel that is right for me. So even more successful singer and people wants to work with me and that amazing name that you just mentioned. They just trust me and they want to write songs with me. So that's why my curriculum sounds so. I mean beautiful.

Numa:
Because they. I have the trust and it was extremely rewarding without being rich or too famous or too. You know what? And they just trust me because they love my work. So that's why they wrote songs with me. That's why I produce things for me. Why this very famous artist in Italy they accept my songs and they help people.

Numa:
I mean input as a producer, as arranger. Or just simply as an idea maker. Because I deliver a lot of ideas so they can use it for the shows for blah blah, blah. So I'm growing up, grown up, grown up, grown up, grown up. Just really trust me just on my own hiring my own team, choosing the people was working with me. Surround me by people. Good good. They really can trust me and love me and understand have my same vision.

Numa:
And then on and on and on and on. Finally eventually I came the TV covered me. So I started to become a transit speaker public speaker. And I started to do a lot of TV shows which I was a all judge for talent show. But judge is a word that for me doesn't. Doesn't exist for me means either guidance. But they call judge say so and then I become a speaker who they call me of of course to discuss about issue musical. I try to avoid gossip because gossip, for me stupid.

Numa:
But anyway, even though when. When is a gossip because the tv you know. It's like even that when he's gossip. I think I find the right way to. To talk about issues. You know what I mean? Just to keep people. I want the people doesn't drink and hear and believe everything people telling him on TV or you know on. On a magazine on what is.

Numa:
Because he's from full of lies. So I want to help people to really really, really, really have the deliver the right deliver. And I promise you from me you can get just true. I promise you. I don't mind if I risk my - the underwear before - but I'm very happy. I'm very happy to tell you truth. So the TV called me for this reason because they know that Numa. Is it true that that guy is famous because have a million views? No, it's not true.

Numa:
The record company bought it. I know that. So you say it's not true. I'm sorry. So you. I can. I can really tell you things how they. How they are.

Numa:
So people can choose and not be hypnotized from the biggest lies, which is the music industry, which is the. The. The biggest bubble of, you know, delivering on lies that can be the music industry. But not just that. I mean even when they. Anything everything is. Is, you know, is a. Advertising, everyday marketing.

Numa:
Is that not just music. So you can choose, of course, but you have to be able to see with your own eyes and choose even if you. Without being stirred by someone else. You know, I want. I want that you make your own choice. So. And then you can say really what you like, what you want to hear, what you want to watch, what you want to choose, what you want to buy. But not without Blade.

Numa:
Yeah, and I try to do.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah, it sounds like all of those early years of failure and hardship really did prepare you going forward into your career now is to be able to say it's not worth all of the, like trying to sensationalize things per se and make big stories out of nothing or to tell an untruth or an unkindness about somebody else because it doesn't really, like the universe doesn't work well that way for you from a karmic perspective. It's like, let us always like, try to speak well of other people so that you have good, positive things coming back to yourself as well. And, and your work has proven to be the highlight. It's not like you were trying to shimmy your way into. Into the limelight. You were just doing wonderful, pure work and it caught the attention of others. And I think that that's really a really powerful lesson as well.

Numa:
And you know what? And we have to be honest also be flexible regarding music, especially because music is music. So music has passion, tastes, thousand colors, a thousand lights. So I learned in. In over 30 years experience that I can do music and any kind of music I did wrote songs with the lyrics which are very proud, they're very deep, and they're talking about the inner child. The way once again, one song is called Stronger, for example, for the listener, if you have a time. I'm. I'm very cred. And I would be honored that you go on YouTube, you put numa, you put a song called Stronger, for example, which talk about how I became stronger is a song that I wrote with a guy called Julian Hinton, which is an amazing render producer, Sailor Stewart, Robbie Williams, the top of the top.

Numa:
The guy was one of my dear friends Reward together Strong, for example. This is another incredible collaboration that I had on trust and love. Pure love. Because you see, the guy was no the God. He was so kind to ride with me. Not just that song, more than one song, but Stronger, for example. And that is a deep. Strong.

Numa:
It's a deep song. And the video clip is one of the most beautiful video clip I've ever done. Because it showed this kind of magic woman that you cannot really understand which kind of dimension she actually come from. But it's to give you this power or the. Or the other or the magic woman that we all are. That we can create this kind of atmosphere or healing and power and become stronger. Stronger for the better. For the better life and better future.

Numa:
The future, for example. Or there is another song that you can still type called the Secret Key which explain exactly in a happy dancing way how works the law on universe. Which telling is not about Mimi. It's just about we. We. And we need to connect. And then we come extremely powerful. If you listen to the lyrics.

Numa:
The splendid Sakia was the lone universe and law of attraction. It's called the Secret Key. It's a pop music, but it's. That's what deliver. And another song, let me say which I so proud of is a Never Give up which is also the video clip. Even that one is just fantastic. Luca Bigazzi is my Luca Bigazzi, Luca Bigazzi. We need to give the names because there are amazing team behind Luca Bitzy.

Numa:
The director created amazing video clip called Never Give Up. He create all of them and never give up. Speaking about our inner hero. We all a hero. We hero. So you see, you see the. In the video clip. This is Wonder Woman.

Numa:
I interpret it Wonder Woman that I lift up a couch with a Hoover. Because you know, because you know how many women women are the suit. They are want the woman in their life. Four children, work, dinner, problems, sorta husband, you know. And they are Wonder Woman. Actually, you know, I really want the woman. So we are all Wonder Woman. So I'm Princess Leila.

Numa:
I did, I did. If you see the video clip, it's amazing. It's called Never Give Up. So you see, the pop music can be extremely intense and have a deliver a very important messages without to be too, you know, heavy or dark or sad or dramatic. I try to give very important messages and try to. Don't be too much dramatic because we have enough to drama.

Jennifer Norman:
Yes, we sure do.

Numa:
Every single day in our life. This time on this last video clip that I done and it's last song I deliberately choose and quite light, not shallow quite light and mood, sun, joy, smiling. And I did Miami because Miami is one of the most happy. I mean sunflower, you know, place that. That I have been in my life. And. And I want to deliver something for the women which is the feminine energy, the sensuality, the beauty that we all have any age, any time. The capacity to be sensual and sexy, but also sweet and smiling.

Numa:
Try to really work on our inner energy in our inner beauty. So I use that as a decentral happy, funny song t called as this and try to trigger this is a kind of vibration to help the women to still enjoy their own body, their femininity femininity correct their own. Their own energy and using in a powerful way. In fact, if you see the. The video to my world, you see me dancing in the middle of the road. You see me be a bit sensual because I want to deliver not this, this message, but then you see me dressed, you know, with a pair of jeans, with a hat on my head that I was dancing in the middle of the. Of the center of my. On downtown Open true live Nothing, nothing, nothing set up with their hands like this open and people embracing me, you know, just there alive.

Numa:
Not like. Like this hugging me. Like these people never met in my life. Never. I mean it was beautiful or me or made me start to. To work with, dance with people never met, never met before and start to dance together. So that's the message. The message is that we all brothers, we can all connect, we can all smile to each other, we can all.

Numa:
And also we need to feel this, the energy of the body, you know what I mean? That sensuality that they're really powerful and it can heal a lot.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah, it's being alive. Well, I love that because you are indeed the self empowerment singer. And it reminds me of how sometimes getting to the simplicity of things, you know, you almost have to go through that long road of complexity and going through that and then just strip it down, strip it down, strip it down. And then you get to a place where it's accessible and then you're like this is it, this is, this is. This is exactly the right balance that you need.

Numa:
You know, that's not. And even when you do the arrangement, you do the very super complex arrangement. Thousands, thousands down and then just.

Jennifer Norman:
You don't need all of that. Take it away, take it away. And then it's like. And then you get to the pure essence of the beat or to the melody and then it's like, yeah, that's all it needs. It doesn't really need too much.

Jennifer Norman:
Hit subscribe right now for more stories and inspiring conversations with me, Jennifer Norman, the host of The Human Beauty Movement Podcast.

Numa:
For example wonder why I'm a thinker about. About simplicity, about simplicity. I mean why I make it. I tell you why. It's a nice tantrum and a. So it's not we nothing to do with the image, nothing we do with the look to be but it's be is about me. Five years ago I had another shift moment. I had a very quick, I have to say quick depression because we have to go up to go down. We have to go down to go up.

Numa:
So that's happened even I mean in such a power. I'm a woman. You have to go down to go up. You have to raise up, understand how it works life. So I had a six months disciple which I was telling I was sad, I was not happy anymore. I said oh my God. It was like a voice inside me says but are you really happy? Are you really express yourself 100% how you feel fulfilled 100% after what I'd done or I went beyond blah blah blah.

Numa:
And so I start to collect all my pictures. I can show you. I show you. I show you physically but I show you certain people because up here I have a. This one.

Numa:
A picture in my... You see this me baby.

Jennifer Norman:
Hello.

Numa:
The true story. It's me when I was. When I was. When I was baby. And I started to do that. I suggest to people to do the same. Start to do that, you see, start to do.

Jennifer Norman:
You've got pictures of when you're a baby. Okay.

Numa:
What'S up? What's up Numa? Listen, are you happy? Are you a happy child? Do you feel loved enough? Are you doing exactly what you want to do? I was doing that, sure. And Noma was answering. Yeah, I mean I'm not happy anymore. I wonder. I mean I'm feeling a bit caged responsibility. Understand I'm a good woman, a good girl, a good wife, a good. But God, heavy, you know what I mean? It's getting heavy here. I don't breathe very well.

Numa:
That was the answer that was getting all the time. And so my Numa, my baby Numa said telling me what to do. So one day I did one video clip that was. I was wearing a pink wig, was happy. I was trying to do a party happy with something cheerful because I need it. I need that kind of energy. And then I saw myself with a wig, pink. And I said, yeah, that's what I hit.

Numa:
I need color. I need to be a baby. I need to be a girl. I need to be wings, you know, I need to be a cartoon. I need to be something that really, really made me put some kind of smile in my face again, as I usually do. But that time I was sad. I was not happy anymore.

Numa:
And then because Numa baby told me, I want to be happy. I want to be smiling. I want to be a child again. I want to see me free again like I was before. She was telling me that because you need to listen. You have to listen what the picture of you, your baby. You tell you so you have to capable to listen for a second. Shut up for a second. Listen.

Numa:
And then I changed my color. And from then on, my life changed. I tell you. Success, Music, love, children, babies waiting. Stop me in the middle of the road. Just want to touch my hair. I want to kiss me, want to embrace me. Mothers happy everywhere I walk, smiling, like up here.

Numa:
Music, work. Everything's changed. So you know when you are able to stop and listen what the boy is telling you, what the you have inside now it's okay. It's all. I'm too busy. No time for that, you know, I'm too big. No, stop, stop, stop, stop. Because you can be the shift of your life.

Numa:
And I did it and took me a little bit courage, braveness to do that. You know, when I come back home at home and my husband look at me with big hair, say, say love. I'm gonna make a change. You say, what? I think I gotta change the color of my hair. I don't turn a pink. And he said to me, my husband is English. No. Okay.

Numa:
No. He is to have the most incredible things.

Jennifer Norman:
All right, Just get me another lager.

Numa:
My wife is mad, so it's crazy. She says I'm crazy, that she's crazy. So I'm used to. And so now I come back with the pink hair like this. Lola was like, dang. And it kind of come in. I kind of accepted it's the same thing. But.

Numa:
But you know what? Because. And it's so different me. So you saw that I was starting and my smile was. Was coming back and all my creativity. And you saw also the feedback of the. How Much the word so good energy song Just telling a funny story. My husband, by the way, is considered an enlightened legend. Is one of my most famous guitarists in the world, among a lot of many famous.

Numa:
But it is that. That guy. Super guy, super musician.

Jennifer Norman:
I wanted to ask you about your marriage because to me I was like, wow, this is like such a marriage made in heaven. As far as just like the music and you know, you're the showgirl and he's the guitarist and you've done collaborations and.

Numa:
Yeah.

Jennifer Norman:
And it took you a while to actually get married. I understand.

Numa:
No, I mean, it was difficult because when we met, well, we were already married, so which is. I mean, life is complicated, guys. It's not always straightforward. So. And you know what? When I met him, I just felt that was the man of my life. I couldn't say otherwise. I mean, it was like that I was 26 years old. I was already having a marriage or we were already having a girl, which I'm sure that happened because I needed to become mother.

Numa:
Because that girl is supposed to come in my life. So was the right moment probably the right person? I don't know. But that life has always a reason. So probably because my daughter could come, just not in that way. Probably so arised. We did it. I mean, we don't. We think to choose.

Numa:
We don't choose. Is the children and choose and find a way to come. That's what says the spiritual law says. Okay, that's the spiritual law says no, we. We're not choosing. Seems they were choosing. No, they choose to come. And so I had this, this.

Numa:
This. This child and I met my husband. It's been introduced by me to me by. This is super, super, super, super, super, super famous singer in Italy. To make you understand, guys, it's like a. It's like Elton John. It's so. It's that famous.

Numa:
It's the Italian Elton John to make sense. Big thanks to you. Okay. Like, you know, the top of the top of the top. This guy, I was really working with him and we said the guy that has a big part of big meaning in my life. Big, big part of. On the. On the scene of my life.

Numa:
This singer and I met and he was doing a dinner and in this dinner with this mytho, this legend that was my husband that was producing him. Because my husband was a producer and player of this. Of these artists that is called Renato Zero. Renato Zero. Because, you know, many people just by curiosity wants to go to see it and can see million and million of video clip and disguise that look like David Bowie, like Elton John. So maybe my curiosity now. Why not even know people that you. That you never seen in your life is interesting.

Numa:
Now let's go to see this guy Renato Zero, which is Italian Elton John to make sense to you. So. And so I met my husband in this, in this, in this, in this dinner. And it was like a. You know, proper, you know when you see the person say oh my God, this is the man of my life. Not gonna do. We're gonna do. We're gonna do.

Numa:
You know, just, you know, you just, you know. I was married, a young child. I was really desperate, you know. And he was married too. And he had the same feeling too when you see. Because we were not in a happy marriage. We have to say this. We were, we were, we were extremely unhappy.

Numa:
Extremely unhappy. But. Cause in life you have to deal with problem, you have to deal with struggle. So you think to get through somehow. You think to. To sort. To find solutions. You try five is normal is right.

Numa:
You got married, you have children. You try to make your best to, to. To go beyond your problems, not to take over your problem. But we were, we were really on our, on in, in my space. Meaning, you know what I mean? We're not happy. So our love just exploded. And it was difficult because was of course unofficial and it was an adventure. It wasn't a date.

Numa:
It was an immense desperate love. You know, when you cannot sleep enough, you cannot breathe a day during the day, you cannot even think to survive with other person. And then I started to travel all around the world just to making once in Nairo for two once. And then holding your water just to say hi. Just. I tell you, I tell you something. I want to be completely honest with you. I want to.

Numa:
Because the audience deserved to have these data. So without say without hypocrisy, it wasn't even a sexual, sexual thing. It was a love thing. You know, we just want to see each other in the eye. In the eye. Because people can think. Of course you go, you're going to do. You're going to meet yourself.

Numa:
Knocking bed with a physical attraction is super beautiful. But wasn't that was love. And so it's been painful, it's been difficult. It's been one of the most difficult divorce and separation that we never had in our life. The because unfortunately we were not able to make our partners understand. There was something that. That was impossible to. To let it go.

Numa:
And so it took over 10 years and in the Meantime, from the little girl, I became a woman. And in the meantime was struggling to grow on my own. My daughter. Because I left my husband immediately, straight away. Because I couldn't, of course, I cannot. I cannot be in two steps. I mean, two feet, two shoes. I cannot do that.

Numa:
My husband took a while before they decided to wear just one pair of shoes. If you pass me the metaphor. Oh, I don't know if I hope that makes sense because I'm translating from Italian to English. The Italian metaphor. I hope that makes sense what I'm saying. Correct. Meaning case. If he took a while before he made to make his choice.

Numa:
But me, I did immediately, straight away. Because, you know, women are more brave. We say no, no, no, no. We can do that. Just one can be have two can have two. So I made my choices. So it was difficult. Prayed, I cried, I waited, I fought.

Numa:
I did everything possible imposs with the man of my life. And eventually, after 10 years, he came to the same. My same ideas 100% we would do it. We've been together, but was struggling, struggling, struggling. And. And finally, eventually we start to travel a lot together. Because he was touring with George Michael. So we were doing a lot of.

Numa:
We were. We were all around the world all the time doing George Michael. A lot of beautiful gigs, but beautiful because it was a nice environment and we were like a family. Was sharing the same passion, love music. I was a singer, was a songwriter. So a lot of things in common, a lot of beautiful moments to share. It was extremely successful in Italy too. So we will share also the same.

Numa:
The same audience, the same. The same environment, but in a nice way. It was a clean way. It was a pure way. It was a loving way. Was like a family. And then finally, finally, finally he found that the courage to be honest 100% to be clear 100% to be in self 100%. And then he got divorced and we got married two months later.

Numa:
Imagine that we. The. We've been legally. Legally with papers wise divorced one month. Because we got married the day of the month, the month after. Because it's been. Because we knew they want to be together best of our life. And then Renato zero with the Elton John Italian Elton John, you know, he came, he became.

Numa:
He was our best friend. Best. So the, you know who would best friends.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Numa:
Sign the Batman. The best man. And all the, you know, music environment was exploded because it was a big couple coming together successful, you know, and together and very well known in Italy. So was something extremely, you know, sparkle. But was Deep. Was very deep. People cry. People was crying of joy.

Numa:
Was like, yes, the lover will win. Yes, yes. No, you know, you know, they were like, you know, people thought it was a 3D cut. If you do it, I can do it. If you make.

Jennifer Norman:
That's so beautiful.

Numa:
So it's incredible story. 28 years together.

Jennifer Norman:
Oh, wow. That is so lovely.

Numa:
28.

Jennifer Norman:
That is so lovely.

Numa:
Thank you.

Jennifer Norman:
Thanks for that. Oh, my goodness. Yeah. That is a long time awaiting. But it's a beautiful relationship that you've had, and it's so nice to see that you are still each other's forever love. So hooray for you.

Numa:
Hooray for you. Together after 20 years and 28 years. And then we know we're still riding together, we're still working together, traveling together, fighting together, arguing together. I mean, this is the marriage which is live. And I'm happy, Bella. And it accepted the pink character. Then we'll.

Jennifer Norman:
We'll keep him.

Numa:
We keep.

Jennifer Norman:
I would love for you to tell us about the Promised Land because it's the song and it's also a humanitarian project that you had done. And I really so in awe of a lot of the work that you have done for UNICEF and for animal rights and for people who have lost their homes, things like that. And so I just want to take a moment to. To talk about your philanthropy and a lot of your humanitarian work.

Numa:
Okay, thank you. We know that we say that we need to make the good. I don't say nothing about it because, you know, it's important. Never. I mean, it's nice to share that. Never brag. Because you know that charity is something that have to come from our heart every single day of our life. And the charity and something that you.

Numa:
Every single moment of your day, just enough that you really give some food to the cat in front of your home. Trust me, we can. We can be so compassionate and we can do so much for this world just by respect. You know that beautiful flowers that you're the front of your front of your garden and just don't walk on it. Just don't do it. Or don't leave your bottle of plastic bottle on the beach. I mean, we can do so much with this planet. With little little, little, little, little.

Numa:
So I. This is always been the philosophy of my life. And the music can do so much. Such a healer. If you do it in a proper way. It's such a. Such a bond of brotherhood or emotion that melts your heart in a good way and make you feel close by and not Separated anymore Make you feel brothers and sister when you sing the same song when you say words that touch your heart. This can do the music and from his land one of the songs that does this and is the anthem anthem of unish effort that has been used internationally nationally.

Numa:
There's also the Italian version and the UNICEF give us the images of the activity on Seals war and you can. If you go. If you go to see onga still in YouTube Numa if you put promised land and you want to put. You can see the. Is it the long version standard version. You can see what's going on there live. Because they gave us the. The images of them and try to help people the false fleeing from bombs and stuff.

Numa:
And. And you know, and. And it's been something that touched. That touched the heart. Touched the heart. I mean because it's been involved as an inspirational song during meetings where nations was talking to each other to find solutions. And sometimes believe it or not, the music emotionally speaking was quite doing more than the words. You know, this is the incredible invisible power of the music.

Numa:
You mean the people talking, talking, talking. Then he started the music. People hold their hands, you know what I mean? It becomes just one. And that's the power of the music beyond the words. And so for example, promised land. So we offer a lot of charity gigs for have been for to raise money for people that need it. Once again, I'm for school for vaccinations, for medical reason for children and families. And then I was ambassador for UN in fact was in an agency that was working for U.N.

Numa:
they say U.N. you called. Yes, in English you say that. And I. I was the ambassador of the Jubilee of the education. So once again try to give an ethic, an ethic thought an ethic message which is always searching and search the balance. The balance between us and the environment between us and the problems between us and the way to solve problems. Because if you act ethically which means that you put your heart and your spirit and your respect and fairness.

Numa:
Correct. Fairness. Correct is correct. And that's. You can never mistake in your action. Okay. If you want to play some games to achieve something that might be good but the way they use not the right way will vanish you as well. So that's why we must do the.

Numa:
I think and. And also I. I do a lot for Eddie. I'm vegan and I am. I love animals, I love nature, I love this planet. And it's my family, it's my home. I'm just a. I mean I'm a Guest and people think that we own this planet.

Numa:
We think that we are the owner wants to come be more rounded that if this planet get angry can, you know, say down like this. And people doesn't understand. One of the doesn't understand that it's just a guess the most beautiful, amazing place in the world in the. In the universe and we must respect it. A people doesn't understand. And this is honestly I dare to say that I don't mind if it's daring that people doesn't connect sometimes parable event with the nature things just the heart the nature does these things because it's nature. But planet suffer the energy sort of mean barely energy. And if we keep killing, hating, bombing, poisoning their hurt when comes a volcano or comes the earthquake or comes this thing, you can say technically, yes, because blah, blah, blah.

Numa:
Because the volcano. Because. Because, you know. Yes. And also because the energy, the field that this planet is immersed into that cause. What cause and there to say that I don't mind. I want to dare to say I.

Jennifer Norman:
Completely agree with you. And for those of you who are listening, who are just listening to this podcast and can't see, there are little fuzzy animals walking back and forth and that's the little clicking sound that you hear behind Pneuma, which is. No, no, don't ever apologize for, for your furry family. They're. Oh, my baby. It's trying to make an appearance. Okay. But yes, that's.

Jennifer Norman:
That's what that clicking sound is. You can see. You can see.

Numa:
She's sorry about that.

Jennifer Norman:
She was.

Numa:
She was leaving the fur and now she's. She's. Now she's. She's. I can call my husband.

Jennifer Norman:
Either, but I agree with you. Numa.

Numa:
Husband. Help me. Legend. A live legend. Come here. I can text him. I think he's better in the room.

Jennifer Norman:
No, I had heard this phrase and I. I truly do believe it. And it's what you were talking about with respect. And that is like whatever we do to the people, we do to the planet. And whatever we do to the planet, we do to the people. Because there is such a symbiotic interconnectedness of all of us with, you know, with Mother Earth, with Mother Gaia. And then, you know, the way, if we're going to exploit the earth, that's the way that we're going to treat people. But if we, you know, really water our flowers, if we pick up the bottles, if we, you know, treat.

Jennifer Norman:
Treat the earth kindly, aren't we also going to have that kind of respect for the People around us too. And it just creates much more harmony rather than thinking like, you know, this, this whole entitlement or this, I own this and it doesn't matter what I do or it doesn't matter, you know, my. Oh, there he is. You know, all of my little actions don't make a difference. They actually do. They, they do because it is an. It's a reflection of you as well as, you know, it impacts your neighbors and then your neighbors impact your community and your community, you know, impacts your country. Yeah.

Jennifer Norman:
Yes. I see him walking around the back. He can't. Yeah, I text him. He can't. He can run, but he cannot hide.

Numa:
That's very sweet. I mean, I said dog help. Yeah. You know, this is a family now. This family works. I mean, when he does interview, the same. No, I do the supporter. When he does his own, his own interview.

Numa:
So we help each other during the interview. You've been saying something very, very important and we have to say this, that Gandhi will say something that will say the similarity of the, of the population. You can understand that the levels of the similarities of the population by its way to treat the animal. And that tells you a lot because we kill animals. We use animals like a proper marketing. We kill, we merchandise, we destroy. We are holocaust every single day or animals. And Gandhi just said the similarity of the population is how we treat animals.

Numa:
So we're not doing very well. And when I go in the beach and I find plastic bottles, so I see, I see things horrible. And I want to say something that I know that I'm daring. I'm daring. But I want to say that people have to. Have to accept my opinion as I have to accept the opinion of the other people. So another things that shock me when I see sometimes people, they're fishing. And I was in Caribbean lately and I was in Miami lately.

Numa:
And I was not just one person that was fishing his own fish and maybe eating for the dinner, which I'm vegan, I will never do that. But, but I can see, I can see that, you know, the, the, the, you know, a kind of the pattern and I can see the story. I mean, you fish, you eat bikes. But I saw this a couple of times. I saw these big nets.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Numa:
No picking out from, from the sea. All the fishes on the beach dying without suffocating guys, because the fish, they dies suffocating. As I put you in the water and you die inside the water by not breathing. And it's the most horrible scene that you can see. Sometimes we, we See horrible movie with people dying. Like I do this to you that. And you know what? This group of people watching like this. What is in the net, Luca Must be that fish.

Numa:
What, what, what. What is coming out from. From. From the water. Oh wow, look. And look how many fishes. Look at that. I said to myself, I.

Numa:
I swear on God, I said oh my God, how can we be so horrible? How can. How can we be so. So heartless? How come people can make it like this kind of, you know, circle this kind of fear. Everybody looking like that waiting that these fishes dies suffocating just because by. By saying oh look what is in the net. What has been what. What came out, what they took it. I mean this means that what we when we're doing this, we.

Numa:
We really forgetting honestly that we are really a brother and sister on the. On this planet. And we. This is not the way to be human. It's not the way. Nothing to do with surviving. Nothing we do with dinner at night. Nothing we do about with, you know, it's nothing to do that.

Numa:
So it's really. It's me. And that has to be changed. That's the wake up call the people needs to have not said everyone have to become vegan. But you cannot enjoy by seeing animal dying in. It's unbelievable. It's unacceptable. It's like you see your own child dying.

Numa:
It's the same things. And dare to say that. But that would change so much in the humanity if we it wake up. If we if wake up on this. On the, on this. On this empathy and the world would be much kinder.

Jennifer Norman:
It is true. And we don't realize the impact that we have on like poisoning the oceans or you know, any even like, you know, spraying pesticides and things like that and, and how it's you know, really harming the planet around us. But on the, you know, on the other hand, I'm always so, so happy when I see stories about people rescuing or when I see people like if there's like a whale that like, you know, gets marred up on the beach. Like the people who go and run to help and you know, and I. And I see a lot of stories like that too which hopefully counterbalance the negative ones. But it is nice to see how much a lot of people do care and I would hope that they're. Yeah that I would hope that their actions actions can also speak more loudly about the humane treatment of. Of animals because yeah it does.

Jennifer Norman:
It is important even. Like it's so funny I remember that there was a Bumblebee in my backyard that looked like it was dying of thirst. And I put a little bit of water out for it and somebody's like, what are you doing? It's a bee. I was like, I want this bee to live. And it's like even as small as like a little bumblebee. Because I mean bees. If we don't have bees in our world, then we don't have ourselves. You know, it's not a matter of time.

Jennifer Norman:
The whole ecosystem collapses. So I'm very careful about the beast that's little.

Numa:
You know, because you know, people say bees. What about they sting. I don't want them. I mean they don't understand how much. Much, much much is the important. We heard we don't survive with the bees, you know, the planet, the entire planet, you know. You know that is gonna die. And this is the awareness that we need to have.

Numa:
It's so important if we start to be more important, more, more kind more. It's about empathy. It's like to try to feel what the other feel if we able to even if he's an animal. And for me it means to be animal means a super soul. I mean for me when I say animal, for me I say something that is above the human because they are more connected, more, you know, more pure. So. But anyway for people that be anyone instead is a level below for someone just for me is level of both. So point of view.

Numa:
But. But even though if you have this empathy to understand. I mean the same if you see people much love cats and dogs. For example my dog. I'm sorry if he's giving a bit of. A bit of disturbing because I tell you what, my dog is six is a bit blind, it's a bit deaf. So I. I sometimes I can.

Numa:
I can she sleep. She. She stay hours. An hour. So. But. But I don't know why now it's just getting a bit exciting. And I struggle to convince her to.

Numa:
To stay put a little. A little bit. Just a little five minutes. But. So I apologize for that. But for once again I have a dog who's 16 years old and I have a five cats and on an old rescue. Because every. Any animal that I have is not brand.

Numa:
It's not brand is a mu. Just save them from terrible situations and blah blah, blah. So if I one time I think to. I think I see these people like me. I mean treating fortunately cats and dogs like child. I mean really family members that people when they die, when they get ill the being people. People devastating like as I am every, every time. So we try is so beautiful to see the capacity of the human being to love animal dearly, dearly with the whole heart.

Numa:
So the sheep is to understand that that kind of empathy, compassion that they have with the dog and cat has to be for any enemy. If we are able to really have this kind of connection. When you see a screw or we see. See a beautiful rabbit with a little, little tiny bum with a. With a fluffy bum and. And there's beautiful, beautiful years and when we see birds and we see. We see any animals that look at you and just want to be alive, just want to be a part of this, they just want to eat and survive on this planet as well. It's really hard.

Numa:
You know, the weather, the food is really difficult for everybody, even especially for animals. And so if we able to feel that, I'm sure that we stop to do what we do when we have the meat on our table and we really have the braveness to go on YouTube and see where that piece of meat come from. Animal screen animal that's been hijacked, has been starved, has been killed, has been sacrificed. I'm sure that when you have the piece of meat in front of your, of your. Of your face, I don't see say that you don't have to eat it, but probably you won't waste it. I mean you will see it in a different way. Not that I go to supermarket and I see just body chopped everywhere. That is normal.

Numa:
It's not normal, guys, trust me. It's not normal that we have a body chopped everywhere, piece of body chopped everywhere. And for us it's just, you know, just an only food. It's a light day and we need to have a different way to approach food. These things at least a different awareness.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah, I very much appreciate and respect your point of view as I'm sure that our listeners will too. And it really just speaks to your level of compassion and advocacy. So thank you so much. I can talk to you all day, numa. But yes, now it's time to bring husband Philip. Hello, I'm Jennifer. You are on the Human Beauty Movement podcast. Are you guys going out tonight? You've got your dinner jacket on or.

Numa:
Yeah, we're just lovely. Yeah, yeah, no, we, we actually we did. We have a. We will do a musical night because we invited by a super nice musician.

Jennifer Norman:
I'll be right over.

Numa:
So we've been called to join, to join as a music.

Jennifer Norman:
Oh my gosh. Well, if I wasn't in la, I Would be right over. But maybe.

Numa:
I tell you what, I will be. I will be in la. My.

Jennifer Norman:
We shall. We absolutely must. I would be so delighted to meet you in person and give you a hug. And Phil, thank you for wrangling the sweet dog.

Numa:
Oh, my goodness. I'm sorry. Because.

Jennifer Norman:
It'S a family affair over there.

Numa:
Everyone.

Jennifer Norman:
This is the guy, the man amid the legend. Yes. Yes. Yeah, we talked a little bit about you.

Philip Palmer:
Okay. That's all good. Okay. Especially next time.

Jennifer Norman:
Too sweet.

Numa:
Yes. But I. You know what? This podcast, I mean, it's. Are so friendly, so family like that. And it's beautiful because you can share also an intimacy that usually when I'm doing TV or when I do you know what other kind of. When I'm in studio recording, there's different atmosphere. So I think that in some way is. It's a more intimate.

Numa:
And then people can also understand that we are human. We are normal person that we have.

Jennifer Norman:
You've got a house with pets and you're getting ready for dinner. No, it's so true. And that's one of the things that I love podcasting so much, is that you can have these kinds of really intimate conversations and go deep on topics and get to know somebody really, really well. I mean, I feel like we are going to be fascinated. Friends forever. Forget it. I mean, so true. Well, I'm.

Jennifer Norman:
I'm going to make sure that I don't take up too much more of your time, Numa. I really appreciate your generosity of time. I always end my podcast with three questions that I ask every guest, and these are questions that are a reminder of what connects us all. Our beauty, our humanity, and the truths that we live by. So my first question to you, Numa, is what makes you beautiful?

Numa:
The love, the heart.

Jennifer Norman:
El corazon.

Numa:
Just and only. Speaking with her heart. Just to just connect it with my. My heart. Yeah. Trust me, there's no more beauty than that than the one when you. When you talk with the heart. We speak with your heart.

Numa:
You listen your heart.

Jennifer Norman:
That's a lovely answer. What does it mean to be human?

Numa:
It means to have empathy. For me, personally speaking, just only for myself. I'm not human if I don't have empathy, if I don't feel the other. Like me, if I don't feel that tree outside. Like me. No, I'm not human being.

Jennifer Norman:
It's just the answer and final question. What's one truth you live by?

Numa:
Love. Just and only. Just and only.

Jennifer Norman:
And I get the answer.

Numa:
So heart, compassion. More beauty than this. More true than this. I love you.

Jennifer Norman:
Incredible. I love you too, Numa. My beautiful humans. Please pay Numa a visit online. You can find her@numaofficial.com that's the website NUMA video channel on YouTube. NUMA underscore Palmer on Instagram. Numa, you have been such a delightful guest. I am just a fan for life and thank you so much for being the beautiful human that you are and...

Numa:
I will come hug you in 2-3 weeks. I will be in LA.

Jennifer Norman:
I'm looking forward.

Numa:
So long guys, thank you.

Jennifer Norman:
Thank you for listening to The Human Beauty Movement Podcast. Be sure to follow rate and review us wherever you you stream podcasts. The Human Beauty Movement is a community based platform that cultivates the beauty of humankind. Check out our workshops, find us on social media and share our inspiration with all the beautiful humans in your life. Learn more at thehumanbeautymovement.com. Thank you so much for being a beautiful human.