Episode 27: Matthew Mackey aka Carbie the Dragtivist - I'm A Non-Binary Drag Queen and Running for Office

0:07 Hello, beautiful humans. Welcome to another episode of Role Models GC conversations with beautiful humans. I'm Jennifer Norman founder of the human Beauty movement and your host. It's my goal to survive inspiration on this podcast. So, if you like what you hear, subscribe rate and review us and share this episode with everyone, you know, across your networks. Most of you know that I'm a big proponent Opponents of humans who live life at the intersection and my guest doesn't just live life at the intersection Z is the intersection. It is my great honor to introduce you to Matthew Mackey. Otherwise known as Carvey the dragged to this. Matthew is running for office as a candidate for New York State Assembly District. 101.

0:51 If Matthew is elected Z would be the first non binary state legislator in New York state and the second in the country. Now from a Edge. Matthew has been an advocate for people from advocating for accessibility resources. For is has two deaf parents to helping stop the deportation of a same-sex binational. Couple Matthew knows how the power of collective action can create real change for people. Welcome, Matthew. Thank you. Thank you for having me. This is fabulous. It is fabulous. I'm so delighted to have you and I am so intrigued by your whole story. Story. Because you grew up in Blooming Berg on a quaint little apple farm called McKee Farms and Milton where your grandfather and your uncle grew apples raised goats and other livestock.

1:41 So, you have to tell us what you were like when you were younger and then how you would describe yourself now. Yeah, so when I was younger, I was a very happy-go-lucky child and, you know, I just tried to live life to the extent that I could as child both, my mom and dad are deaf. So I had to balance. The life of being a child and having responsibility of translating for my parents for the phone or even as something as simple as going to the grocery store and translating conversation between a cashier or Deli counter worker. So as a child there was that kind of responsibility and as an adult I'm still the same happy-go-lucky person as I was and funny story.

2:24 When I was a child I always used to say that I wanted to be a Care Bear. When I grew up everyone who asks me every Teacher. I was like, I want to be careful when I grow up and lo and behold. I'm a Care Bear. So you learned sign language at a very young age because your parents are deaf and you are advocating early on in life. Can you tell us what it's been? Like, because I am actually the mother of a disabled boy and I have become his biggest Advocate, his biggest proponents and so when it starts from home, it really means something more to you, doesn't it? It really does. And as a child, In sign language and growing up in a time period where we have the Americans Disabilities Act?

3:06 However it was just enacted around the time period, I was born. So sometimes with governmental policy, we don't think ahead of how we're going to make sure something works and that was very much the case with the Americans with Disabilities Act. So there wasn't a lot of Public Access or resources for people with disabilities, which is why. As a child, I had to step in and be a translator. And advocate for my parents and even going growing up and going through grade school, making sure that my parents had the same access to events that were going on at the school and having translators available so that I didn't have to do it. And I could appreciate being a child and was a very big part of my life growing up. Most of my family didn't learn sign language. So, I was really the only one that people relied on. Wow.

3:58 And so, you really have Taken that on as being the Care Bear and not only helping your parents but really thinking about how the act and maybe in its progression and other sorts of policies. Do help the greater good, the greater public? Yeah. Absolutely. I take a lot of the way I view policy and how we can create change in our environment based off of the experiences I've had in my life and sharing those experiences. Makes that more powerful argument for making policy change. Now, there is a story about the disability awareness, art contest that you want in the 4th grade. Can you tell us about that? Yes, so when I was in the fourth grade, I had this great teacher, her name was mrs.

4:44 Moore, Jackie. And she was inspired by my life story to have all of the students in her class learn a little bit of sign language but also bring awareness to lots of different disabilities and so We all were in an art contest and she submitted every single Student Art to New York state for a disability. Awareness art contest and I am not by any means a good artist. Okay, I don't try, I would, I would actually disagree with that but we were in the fourth game. So yeah, so I drew a picture of me and my dad signing to each other and we both signing the sign language for. I love you, which is this.

5:29 This for everyone. I know that it's getting a little worried that there you go. So it means I love you in sign language and so I drew this picture of us signing back and forth and misspelled the word sign to sing and sent it to New York State. And I got third place and they brought us all up to Albany, this really awesome. That's amazing when I was learning sign language as a youngster. I think I learned, I love you as I love you. So it's been Court handed which I Is great. Yes. Wow. So are you comfortable giving us some background on your coming-out story? Oh absolutely.

6:10 So my coming out story has like three main parts. I grew up in a very rural conservative environment where everyone was really religious and I grew up in a church that essentially said you're better off being dead than being gay and so it New York. This is an Upstate New York. Yeah. So so growing up as a young person and trying to figure out my life, it was all very confusing and unfortunately I also fall into the category of lgbtq people. That's very common to have a negative coming out story and Trigger warning. I'm going to talk about suicide. So I had a lot of suicidal ideation because there was that message being drilled into my head. You know, you're better off being dead than being gay and at the I meant I started having these really bad negative thoughts about myself and what I could do to end it all. Really I call it divine intervention, call it coincidence, but my stereo alarm went off and it just played this really bright music that I had never heard before almost verging on classical music and whatever it was. In that moment made me stop and really made me go. You are worthy.

7:27 You are worthy of Happiness, you're worthy of joy. You're worthy of love. You don't need to worry about this, so I decided then I was going to live my life the way I wanted to and be open and out and honest. So I told my mom and my mom cried and then I was like, why are you crying? And my mom said because I'm so happy that you finally, you know, discovered who you are. I've always known that, you were different than most people, but there was that. And then my dad had a more negative reaction. He essentially told me I was going to go to hell, and I was going to die of AIDS and that he wishes that I could have told him sooner so that he could have quote-unquote fixed me. So, it was very heartbreaking.

8:15 And that's when I decided I needed to get away from all of that, negativity, and all of that pressure and really start somewhere new where I could live my truth and be happy. Yeah, well, thank you for sharing. And all of that. And your story is not uncommon, and especially when it comes to rural communities where there's a heavy influence of religion. And, you know, there's just this sense of control and an old. So, you know, patriarchal type of thinking and I congratulate you also just like your mom because I kind of consider myself a big mama bear to, I mean, I congratulate you for having the courage to step out and be yourself. It is not easy, especially when Faced with those kinds of reactions and, you know, that they're coming. But it's more important for you to live your truth than to die in a lie.

9:09 And it takes time. It takes healing. It takes a bit more understanding and now thank goodness years have gone. By there is a bit more openness and society when it comes to lgbtq communities and support and rallying but it's still there. And yeah, the whole influence of the, you know, this narrow mindset. Of not letting live and live is, unfortunately, it's very much still pervasive, which is why you're doing what you're doing right now making. Yeah, it's representation matters. And you know, those stories being heard by people makes change, I always lived my life in a way of, you know, change and growth happens through uncomfortable circumstances and uncomfortability. So getting that story out there and, you know, either most comfortable, Story for people to hear but that story will resonate with them and hopefully make change in their lives. Yeah, the only way out is through. It's true.

10:09 Amen. For you doing that now. You created the first lgbtq+, student organization on Mary mounts campus, in 2008 when you were there and then the following year, you helped organize Marymount students to attend the national equality March in Washington. D.c., tell us about all of this because you started to develop even more activism as you. I started getting into college and Beyond yeah. So when I went to college, you know, I used a lot of the same advocacy skills that I learned as a child. And I recognized, here's this group of lgbtq people. And I went to a liberal arts college that had a large theater and dance program, so like the largest Department in the whole school.

10:52 So there was a ton of lgbtq people and none of them had a voice. None of them had a place that they could go. Two and really share the experiences that they've had or even, you know, talk about inclusive, sex education. And so I created this group, it was a gay-straight Alliance in the day and we had about 50 people sign up within the first week of us being an organization and we started meeting monthly at first and then weekly, and we talked about tons of different lgbtq and queer issues. And then started making change in the school to make us more visible. Yeah.

11:34 And doesn't it give you that sense that you're not alone because I think when you're going through something like this, you feel alienated and ostracized. And that's a lonely existence. But then all of a sudden you discover your people, you discover your community and there's nothing but love. And it feels so good to know that you're in the right place. You're in the place where you belong. Yes. Absolutely growing up in a rural area where I didn't even think I had known another. Person growing up and then all of a sudden having a ton to create this Vibrant Community of support and people that, you know, you can go to who've had similar experiences in your life was life-changing. So when the National Quality March was happening, I had found out about it a week before the March was supposed to go.

12:22 And so, I, rallied, everyone together went right up to the student organization and the student board and said, Hey, listen, There's this March we should all go. We should do it, we should represent the school and it was like three days later. They gave us permission. Got a bus and we all went down. That is so beautiful. You know, this reminds me of a story when my son was first diagnosed with his disability, he had a nurse that had started with us, 21 years old right out of, you know, nursing school. And he was openly gay. And I remember my mom who was a very religious person, always like all of my life. Hot the same exact thing. As you know, your family had been taught is that oh you're going to hell if your perverted person you know gay people or just going to be condemned.

13:09 And when she saw the love that this person had for my son and how very much he cared for him. And just his overarching Spirit after spending some time with him, she literally said to me there's no way he's going to hell. And I said yeah. And it just shows you. There's a lot of ignorance, it's just, you know, people just don't understand and they're fearful of what they don't know. And so I think that now that we're helping with awareness and education and, you know, they always say the best way to get rid of fear is exposure. It's just no, get in front of people that you don't normally spend time with and that's what diversity and inclusion is all about.

13:54 It's like not being afraid of somebody who's different from you and being okay with letting them live their lives. The way that they wish to, As Long As nobody's hurting each other or doing any harm, then, you know, it's all in good fun and it's all about Joy. It's all about yeah, we're all human beings at the end of the day trying to make our lives better. Beautiful humans. That's what I say. Now you're running for New York State Assembly, District 101. Did you always know you wanted to be a politics? Absolutely. Not the hardest thing from honestly, The I never thought I was going to be a politician. I never thought I was going to get involved in politics. I always had an interest in policy and how it affects Community groups, but never really thought. Okay, I'm gonna go do something and that really changed when I was a family advocate for children who have special needs. And so, I spent a lot of time arguing with insurance companies and to make sure they had benefits and they paid the benefits.

14:59 And what really changed that was, I had a client whose child had traumatic brain injury due to an accidental gunshot wound to the head and they were in an inpatient rehabilitation center learning how to walk and talk again for eight months. And I had spent eight months fighting the insurance company to pay about two million dollars worth of medical bills and this is right around when covid-19 arting. So, the medical team came To me and the insurance company. And said, hey, if this child gets covid, their immune system is not going to be able to handle it and they will not make it and the insurance company kept denying at home therapy so that he could continue to walk and talk.

15:47 So we fought with the insurance company for three months, trying to get the outpatient services that they needed, and, unfortunately, because of the bureaucracy, And loopholes of insurance. They just kept denying. And unfortunately, the child, contracted covid and died a month later and that sparked a lot of frustration and a lot of anger and sadness for me because I treat everyone, as if they were my own family. And I was like, I'm fed up. I'm tired. Enough is enough things have got to change. This shouldn't be legal that insurance. Companies could just deny this so I decided I was going to start running for office and I was going to social work school at the same time and found out, there's such a thing as legislative and policy social work. So I changed my focus to that.

16:44 And then used my time in school, to create a platform, based off of all of the different issues that my district needs. Gosh, wow. What a catalyst. I'm so sorry that that happened but I know that sometimes These things will help to lead to change so that perhaps it won't happen as much in the future, for sure. Yeah. So can you give us an insight into your platform? What are those changes that you wish to see more specifically? So, specifically in my district, we have a huge issue with rural Healthcare and Rural mental health. There are portions in my district, where it takes two hours to drive, to find a doctor, and then you have to wait, six months to be seen by a car. Mary care physician or even longer. If you're seeing a specialty care provider, there are some counties in my district, where there's only one mental health facility in the whole County.

17:39 And so, the access and the resources are just not there for any type of health care, or mental health care. We also struggle with broadband and cell phone service which I know is not the most popular topic to in the world to talk about. But there are times when I'm driving through the district and I don't have cell service for two hours and Back roads. God forbid anything happens. There's a real public safety issue there. And then of course, you know I want to enact New York Health, the New York Health act which is a Universal Health Care system that would guarantee healthcare for every single person in this state regardless of your income regardless of where you work and it just opens up multitude of different providers for people within the state. That's amazing, I wish.

18:29 Is that the whole process of getting through insurance and claims and all of that was so much smoother. I am longing for that day because it is a full time job advocating and sitting on the phone and writing letters and all of that, it's not easy and I live in premature, you know, I live in Los Angeles. It's a metropolis here and I don't take for granted that I have both private and public insurance and and so if one is denied, then I have, you know, others that I can rotate too. But my heart goes out to People who don't have the opportunities because of the lack of access. It's not you. It is extremely difficult, especially in rural communities, and, you know, ironically, the insurance company that I was arguing with was also the insurance company that hired me to Advocate on behalf of the families. They were representing.

19:21 So it became this whole process where it's rather ironic, that you're paying me to do something that you should already. He be doing on behalf of the clients that you serve, not. I mean, and it is necessary, particularly with kids who have special needs, because the statistics are that families who have children with special needs, go to the doctor seven times more frequently and spend seven times longer on the phone with insurance companies and medical doctors when they could be focusing. All of that time towards their child, which is more important. Now, if you win, you'll become the first non-binary elected representative in the New York state government. How does that make you feel?

20:08 It makes me feel really proud of the fact that it's 2022, non-binary people have been here forever, and just because we have new terms for it doesn't mean that it didn't exist in the 15th, 1600s. Yeah, and I would be extremely proud to be the first non-binary, New York state legislator and I think it really does give me. Me a different kind of insight to how to run politics and how we can actually work together. Instead of being so divisive, which is what we see our politics, becoming because as a non-binary person I do recognize that there is a spectrum of genders and it's not just this binary issue and the same thing happens in our politics is we have a spectrum of different political beliefs but were Bind to these two parties that really are, is coming to a head in a clash point with one another.

21:07 That it becomes so divisive versus, I'm running to represent everyone in my district. So the way I look at it as you know people over parties that people matter more than one party or the other and breaking away from that cultural norm that we have. Exactly. Are you running on an independent ticket? No, so it's extremely hard to run in New York state on an independent line because of how the laws are created in my state. It makes it that much more difficult to run as an independent. So I am running on the Democratic ticket, but I'm also running on the Working Families party, which is a third party in New York state that represents Working Families and individuals and unions. So I'm going to be running on their ticket as well. Got it, got it and it makes perfect sense. And I completely understand.

22:01 I'm wearing my blue and I'm wearing my purple, blue red or purple here in between there you go. I'm curious. Do you have any role models that help shape to you during your whole life? Probably my, grandmother on my dad's side, she always had a way of being kind and making sure that everyone around her knew her experiences as well. Well, she wrote a book based off of raising a deaf child and you know, she had done so much for her community and advocacy. So I really got those lessons from my grandmother. She always used to say kindness is something that everyone can afford.

22:44 And probably my grandmother, my mom and dad were both very influential regardless of my coming-out experience. My dad was a very kind and giving person joyful and you know, everyone who knew him like Knew what Joy was so that really resonates with me as well. And same thing with my mom. She had her own struggles and she powered through it, and she is a great person. And she taught me the power of really getting uncomfortable, and becoming a better person through that uncomfortability. Yeah, that's amazing. And I think that that's so important as you're entering into politics. Because I think once people get into that, Whole round you think about ruthlessness a lot of broken promises you know doing whatever you know you need to do and possibly compromising your integrity in order to do it.

23:39 And as long as you have that strong Foundation of kindness and backbone, and really, being for people and not power. And that's what being a public servant is really all about. And I congratulate you for running and doing something that wasn't your whole life's, you know, intention to begin with and is often the antithesis of what people would All joy, but we're hands. It's very important. Yeah, I like to bring joy back into politics. Everyone. I meet, you know, sometimes I'll even sing while I'm doing a campaign event, because, you know, why not? We're all human beings and it's just good to connect on that kind of level. Yeah. And speaking of that, you are a drag queen also. So, when did you join the drag community and when did you develop a love for makeup and fashion? So my first drag performance ever was, when I was a freshman in college at Suny Fredonia, I went there for one year and I met a group of people that did drag professionally and I was like, what is this?

24:47 I have no idea because, you know, growing up in a rural conservative environment you don't get exposed to that. So I went to my first drag show ever and I was flabbergasted. Gasps Ted I went to this bar called March Hellas in Buffalo New York and I was like completely. Like there was an epiphany in my mind like I would really like to do this. So they did an on-campus drag show and someone made a dress for me. Someone let me borrow heels and borrow makeup. And I looked like a total hot mess but it was like the best time of my life. No.

25:29 No makeup tutorials back then, on YouTube. So, that was my first drag performance and, you know, throughout the years I've been doing drag on and off and now I'm car be the drag tipis. I do dragon activism on Tick. Tock, I do a lot of validating lgbtq Youth and really letting them know you know your valid you don't need to be afraid. It gets better and people do come With a lot of heartbreaking stories from age 10 and up like telling me their struggles and I let them know that they're valid and it's okay to feel that the way they're feeling right now. And then I do a lot of activism work on the side as well. Oh, my gosh, what do you think about the current state of inclusion within the political world? I think that the current state of our political world is not very inclusive.

26:29 To lgbtq people as a whole. I mean I won't name parties but there's a party that's literally trying to take away the rights of lgbtq people and erasing them from existence in education and in books and literature by Banning lgbtq stories and that is really conducive to what we were talking about before about this two-sided issue where our politics is really coming into a turning point really. And we have another party whose More inclusive. But there isn't enough representation for lgbtq people, and that is from local legislators. All the way up to Federal legislators like Congress. And, you know, although I will say this, the current Administration, the Biden Administration has the most inclusive cabinet of any Administration that has ever happened.

27:25 So we are making great strides, but we're not 100% there yet. Yeah, yeah. Here's to forward progress. And so I'm just curious. Do you have any advice for those that might be struggling to follow their dreams? Yes. So you're valid, you're worthy. Allow yourself the time to let your dreams expand and create new Visions within yourself and allow yourself the openness to really discover who you are. And as you grow through time, you'll see that your dreams. Do you change? So if you're struggling to find your place or even to know what your dreams are know that, it's okay to not know and also it's okay for your dreams to change over time.

28:13 Absolutely Matthew Mackey running for office, running for New York State Legislature and in District 1 0 1. Those of you in District 1 0 1, get-out-the-vote register, get out to vote on November 8, 2020. Me too Matthew. Mackey is your choice Matthew for change. It is a delight to speak to you today. I'm so so much Jennifer and thanks to all of you, I'm honored as well. So, thank you so much.