From Cystic Acne to YouTube Stardom with Chris Gibson, America’s Holistic Esthetician

Jennifer Norman:
What if radiant, healthy skin wasn't about expensive creams or painful procedures, but about harmony, humor and a holistic approach to life? Today's guest knows that better than anyone. Chris Gibson is America's holistic esthetician, a best selling author, licensed skincare formulator and beloved YouTuber whose channel Chris Gibson Live has empowered more than half a million followers to rethink what true beauty and self care mean. Chris' journey began with a deep, deeply personal battle against severe cystic acne. A struggle that led him through years of frustration, depression and trial and error before he discovered the power of natural healing. His transformation not only changed his skin, it changed his purpose. His breakout book, Acne Free in Three Days, sold over a million copies, launching a decades long mission to help others heal from the inside out. Now in his 60s with skin that seems to defy time, Chris continues to inspire people worldwide through his warm, science backed and refreshingly candid approach to skincare and wellness.

Jennifer Norman:
In this episode, you'll discover how holistic skincare can transform not only your appearance, but your confidence and mental well being, the truth behind the most popular anti aging myths and how small daily rituals can help you glow naturally at any age. So for all you beauty enthusiasts and wellness seekers who are tired of of skincare overwhelm, this conversation will remind you that the most beautiful skin is the one that reflects a balanced, authentic you. So let's get into it. Hi Chris, welcome to the podcast.

Chris Gibson:
Thanks for having me.

Jennifer Norman:
Oh, it's a delight. It's so wonderful to have you. Okay, so you have quite a story. When you were young. Yes. You struggled with cystic acne. That is something that so many young people are tortured with. And tortured is probably the right word because it really does have an impact on everybody's self esteem and their confidence, emotional health.

Jennifer Norman:
Can you take us back to that chapter of your life and what ultimately sparked your healing transformation?

Chris Gibson:
Yeah. You know, if somebody told me back then when I was struggling with all that that I would be doing what I do today and all of a sudden it's happened along. I wouldn't have believed it. I wouldn't have believed it because when you're in the midst of that, it takes all your attention. Like it colors everything like any illness does, especially if you're young. So the fact that I kept getting my hopes up, well, we're going to give you these medications and that should didn't get rid of it easy.

Jennifer Norman:
Accutane.

Chris Gibson:
Yeah, I did Accutane when it came out early in the early 80s. It was a little better while I was on it. I did that twice, actually.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah. And it was all about like, oxy-cute 'em, alcohol, like those really harsh things. We scrubbed and we did all these crazy things, all the...

Chris Gibson:
All the wrong things. I had a really good dermatologist, which was how I learned about sunscreen early on. And hot warm water, steam cloth. Not every product is right for you just because it says it's an acne product. I learned that from the dermatologist when I was younger, that if it's not helping then it's just not helping, it's not right and not to dry out your skin. So he was a pretty progressive for that time.

Chris Gibson:
For that type of illness, the whole goal was to prevent scarring. They didn't look at it from a something's off in your digestion or something. They didn't look at it that way. They looked at. Well, everybody gets it. Or like almost everybody gets it. So we want to prevent scarring. And that's what they would tell you.

Chris Gibson:
And you would go in, we're going to have you do. So we don't want you to have scars left over when it clears up. Well, it just never cleared up. So when I was in my early 20s, you know, I was wanting to be in broadcasting and on television, and the agents were telling me that was going to be a problem I need to get. Because I had cystic acne. This is not just a little bump here, here. This bumpy looking skin.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
So I go to the dermatologist, the top one there in Dallas, where I lived at the time in my regular job, where I could afford that. And they handed me the same prescriptions, the same thing, and I just put them in the trash. I remember dropping those in the trash can a little bit trash thing on the way out the door. So I paid for nothing. So that's what started me looking outside of that answer, because it was not an answer.

Jennifer Norman:
Mm.

Chris Gibson:
10 years of that, 11 years of that. Not an answer. So I ended up going to an herbal store. Somebody mentioned to me that herbs could help them. So. And there was no vitamin shops in the 80s. You didn't have any of that stuff. You had to go.

Chris Gibson:
The store was at the end of a shopping mall. Look, it was an occult store. So they had the herbs and then the incense, all the other stuff.

Jennifer Norman:
A cult store.

Chris Gibson:
Yeah, the occult store.

Jennifer Norman:
The occult store.

Chris Gibson:
The occult store.

Jennifer Norman:
So there were tarot cards, incense.

Chris Gibson:
Yeah. And then some.

Jennifer Norman:
Some herbs and tinctures.

Chris Gibson:
Because no one was. Doctors were saying back then, you didn't need vitamins. They were not worth your time.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
So now we know different, right? So I took the herbal medication that I was given and it made it worse. And they tell me it would probably make it worse where it got better. And that's when the light bulb went off. Oh, wait a minute. See, I'm eating something and it's doing this. It's gotta be something I'm eating.

Jennifer Norman:
Oh.

Chris Gibson:
So I dug deeper into the holistic side, went on a fast for three days. I talk about that in the book. So without dairy and sugar and all this stuff in my diet, guess what? The acne stopped. It stopped. The redness went away, the bumps went away. It was insane. I mean, I had been dealing with that for so long. And so I went on probiotics, which were again, not very popular.

Chris Gibson:
There was no activity.

Jennifer Norman:
WowsYou were ahead of your time.

Chris Gibson:
Way ahead. Way, way ahead. So I learned about fasting. I learned about digestion, colon cleanses, sunscreen, really early on. And that has benefited me, obviously throughout the years. I still do intermittent fasting now. Still don't have a lot of sugar in my diet. Now, occasionally that gets in there.

Chris Gibson:
But if I, even today, if I start really getting too far across the line with refined sugars, I will get bumps, I will start to get bumps, I will get breakout.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
So for me, there are a lot of things that go into acne breakouts. So don't spend too much time here. Your diet really does. They know now that the spikes in blood sugar can really make flare ups for rosacea, eczema and acne much, much worse. So you really do yourself a favor by taking that stuff out of your diet for a while and seeing the results. So that's what I wrote the book on, was my experience. Not it was not a how to, it was what I did. And it resonated with a lot of people at that time.

Chris Gibson:
So, yeah. Now today we know different light therapies are helpful for acne. Different wavelengths of light are helpful, all in controlling the bacteria. Because there's three things that go in there. That's the pore size and the way your skin works as an individual. Your chemistry, the oil you produce, and the bacteria that we all have. We all have that acne bacteria on our skin.

Chris Gibson:
It eats our skin, oil it digests it. Yeah. So it's only in certain individuals that it's a problem where your immune system goes, what is that? And treats it like an infection. So instead of getting a little zit or a blackhead, you get a cyst around it. So in those individuals especially now, we know that altered dairy products can cause that to be worse. Sugar, refined sugars, a high sugar diet, which isn't good for you anyway for a lot of reasons.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
Making sure you have enough fiber, you eat, you eat a well balanced meal. The Mediterranean diet is the easiest thing for people to recognize when we talk about this. But it's a little bit different. It's a little bit. Yeah, it's anti inflammatory. It's a little bit different for everybody. Yes. Some things don't bother people.

Chris Gibson:
Some things do. But my dermatologist told me it wasn't the chocolate, it was the sugar and the chocolate. Even before I put that together, that my diet, I wasn't. When I was in college, I lived on that stuff.

Jennifer Norman:
Right.

Chris Gibson:
I mean I was working overnight as a police dispatcher, believe it or not, while I went through school. So here I'm up all night studying as my grades were good because I had nothing else to do in a little small town. Right. And then I was eating snicker bars and all this stuff, terrible stuff. And so my skin was reacting to that. So I learned about antibiotics and how to rebalance my gut health and that. I think one of the reasons the book exploded when it did is that's when the superbugs became apparent and the overuse of antibiotics.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
The evidence was so, so there that the pharmaceutical company is in the medical establishment. Couldn't really argue with it anymore because people were dying from that.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
So MRSA and all of those things just happened to be around the time I was already on television talking about gut health and stuff. So it was a really interesting time. But it just re solidified to me. It's just like today, whenever I do a video on something, I talk about skincare ingredients and what to expect from them and when you should call it quits and teaching people to take the selfie when you start something, when it 30 days, 60 days, 90 days. Educating people that take skin a long time to respond to stuff, unless it's traumatized like a peel, you're not going to instantly wake up. I don't care what it says on the label and look 10 years younger. Not going to happen. Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
I'm very, very straightforward with that and I think that's helpful because there's a tendency in the skincare industry still to word things in such a way that it would lead you to believe that you're going to get an X result very quickly and it just doesn't work that way. It Just doesn't. So, yeah, it's been a while ride and I'm not done yet, apparently.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah, yeah.

Jennifer Norman:
Hit subscribe right now for more soulful stories and inspiring conversations with me and the Human Beauty Movement podcast.

Jennifer Norman:
Wow. So much to talk about here because it seems like fast forwarding now, a lot of people are more aware and educated about functional medicine. Food as medicine. The idea of like a Mark Hyman 10 day detox and getting rid of like those refined sugars and the dairies and things like that too. It's almost like that elimination diet to see what is actually causing a lot of the woes that we have either with our physical health. Because a lot of people have heart problems, gut problems and immunity problems.

Jennifer Norman:
And of course, when it comes to skin care, we didn't put those things together. Like what you're eating is actually like affecting your skin. We used to think that it was just like, you're eating too much pizza or greasy food and you're getting a greasy face because you're eating grease. But no, who would have ever thought back then that it's like the sugar and we're battling against all of these big food companies that are selling us all this junk because it's addictive to eat so much sugar and it is all these hidden sugars that are in a lot of processed foods. So if we eliminate processed foods and we get more to a whole food kind of a diet, then yeah, a lot of things will dramatically improve. Maybe not overnight, but. And you might feel worse before you get, you know, feel better or look worse before you look better, but eventually, yeah, it's incredible how it can actually help in so many aspects. And so how interesting that you were able to find that early on and really kind of proselytize the idea of holistic health as far as something that helped you and your skin.

Jennifer Norman:
And then it's starting finally take effect many, many, many decades later.

Chris Gibson:
Yeah, you know, that's the thing. It was never about. I wasn't focused on anti aging. I was focused on clear skin. So it wasn't until I got, when I turned 50, we went somewhere, it was. You had to be carded, I can't remember. It might have been in Vegas. It might have been one of the casino things.

Chris Gibson:
But it was something like that. And I wasn't expecting for someone to check my ID. And so that's the first thing is, wow, you don't look anything near 50 now. I was 40 when I was on TV for the book and TV producers would come in expecting a 40 year old. And they're like, wait, you don't look 40. You don't look. I said, well, how old do I have to look? They were expecting someone to come on.

Chris Gibson:
And I've always had high energy and because I work out, I'm big on my fitness as well. It's not just skincare. So I usually have a sound this raspy. I sound raspy. I sound old today. The usual to me.

Chris Gibson:
I like that sounds terrible. But normally I'm high energy. People would get on YouTube and go as soon as they found out how old I was, they're like, that can't be true. So there are a lot of people my age. They'll look just fine. I know them, not even just celebrities, but I mean people that have really focused on their well being and leaned that way most of their life usually aren't broken down or feeling tired. I don't have that stuff. So it's not really that unique.

Chris Gibson:
But I think what we see and what's put in front of us as far as what the media's portrayal of aging has been is does play a role like the way you dress, how you take care of yourself. Yeah, I love. My favorite meme is the Golden Girls. Meme of them at my age.

Jennifer Norman:
Right?

Chris Gibson:
They did. And then people the same age today.

Jennifer Norman:
Yes.

Chris Gibson:
If they were to redo that show how different it's so true they look. And it's one. Over time, even with all the crappy food and stuff, general health of the entire world has gotten better. I mean, we're learning though, you know, genetically it should pay off as you go through generations. Just like people are so much taller now. Did you ever notice that? Somebody told me that the generation, the two generations now are naturally are taller on average, especially the men.

Jennifer Norman:
Oh, interesting.

Chris Gibson:
I used to be the tall guy. Like I was the tall.

Jennifer Norman:
How tall are you.

Chris Gibson:
I was six feet tall, okay. I was the tall guy. Like I was taller than everybody in my class. And all the pictures, you go back and look in the yearbooks and I'm the tallest one. I walked to an airport down like, good grief, everybody's a giant now. They're huge. But it's because their parents had better. You know, My mom was a depression era child, so she was born in 35.

Chris Gibson:
So of course there were rations and she had bone. Her health was not great as she got older from like bone density and arthritis and all that. I don't have arthritis at all. And I'm 61. So she really paid the dues for that life. But then My life was much healthier. And I think I got things earlier that things people get in general today. So I think that's part of it, just our outlook.

Chris Gibson:
And then you've got shows that are from the 80s that you watch today, and they're so relevant topic wise, irrelevant topic wise, with the exception of smartphones. But the people look exceptionally older. And so I think it's a little bit slanted. But I do get most of my friends. I will say those of my friends are in their 30s to 40s, a few 50s, and I have two that are my age that can keep up with me. And they complain about their friends that are the same age slowing down, all this stuff that's going on. And I'm like, I'm not slowing down. You're lucky.

Chris Gibson:
I had a black eye up until like a week ago. And you know how I got that? How did you get it outside in a tree. Here in Florida, we have in California.

Jennifer Norman:
Is there a story behind you being up in a tree?

Chris Gibson:
Yeah, I was cutting limbs out. I was frustrated with the way it looked.

Jennifer Norman:
So rather than having a cat or anything.

Chris Gibson:
Okay, no, not that glamorous. Rather than having the yard guy do it, I impatiently got up there. And in Florida, the palm trees are rough, they're scrubby. So they've got these. When you cut the limbs off, these pieces stick out like this. It's kind of pretty. I mean, like a texture thing. They're not those long, skinny California palm trees or coconut palm trees.

Chris Gibson:
So I, on the ladder, climb up there to cut the limb, and the limb snapped and got me right above the eye. Just a little cut right here. But then I stepped on those things that stick up like this. Well, they're all rotten, of course. So then I slide down and I scraped my hand. It's all healed now. I heal. I'm a super healer. I heal really fast.

Chris Gibson:
My friends saw that. The next week they saw me. They go, how's that possible? Yeah, I've always been like that. So scraped my knee, scraped my hand. My neighbor said, I heard the leaves ruffle, and I heard, woof. And she goes, well, that's an ambulance trip for him. And I popped up and I'm like, I'm good.

Chris Gibson:
So this little cut, though, this is the aging thing. This little cut, though.

Jennifer Norman:
I was like, I can't see it.

Chris Gibson:
No, it's all... It's almost all completely... You know, there's a little mark here. So over the next 12 hours, my eyes started to turn black here. Went across my eyelid and then curled out sort of like an Egyptian. The Egyptian eye makeup. It looked like that on one side. Then the whole eye turned black, and it was at a raccoon eye from a little cut right there, however, looked really cool, actually.

Chris Gibson:
Oh, well. Everybody said, you need to tell a better story like that. You should see the other guy.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
It never hurt. It never swole, but it has... swollen a bad way. It didn't swell up. It is gone. So, of course I knew. I knew to use vitamin K cream and helichrysum oil. There are things I know to help that process. But the healing process on my hands, that's...

Chris Gibson:
This was really scraped up, and it's like completely gone. So I think that's just. My general health is good, which I know. And I do monitor it. I do blood tests every quarter. I pay for them myself. Do a whole panel to just to check where everything is. I love the biological marker test, which says, I'm 38 to 40.

Chris Gibson:
Even though I'm 61, like so if I will stay out of trees, I might make it to 100. You just never know.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah. I think about when my mom was 35, she had six children. And I look at pictures and I'm like, man, when I was 35, I was just having my first child or my. My first and only child. And there's just such a difference now. And part of it, I think, is because people are. There's almost like this difference where, yes, people are more sedentary. There are a lot of issues with people just not getting proper nutrition and proper, proper fitness, as it were.

Jennifer Norman:
But then there's also, on the flip side, much more awareness and interest in longevity and vitality and looking and feeling your best. And so I think that as we are able, like on this podcast and on your YouTube, educate more people about the benefits of wellness, of holistic true health, of just, like, really taking care of yourselves. And this temple that we have, then we'll be able to have a lot of more people living healthier and much more vital longer. And that's really the goal. We want people to be as healthy as possible. I mean, looks and all of that aside, it's like you want to be able to, like, wake up and not feel good, not feel achy. You want to be able to keep up. You want to just be able to be your vital best.

Chris Gibson:
That's like healthy, happy, healthy, happy, healthy, happy, healthy, happy, healthy, dead.

Jennifer Norman:
Not suffering. Yeah, yeah.

Chris Gibson:
Anything can happen to anybody anytime when it comes to dis ease. But you really do improve your odds of mobility and Energy. As long as you stay at it, it just make it consistent and a habit.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
So I will catch myself sitting too long. Smartphones are the worst because.

Jennifer Norman:
Right. Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
I didn't have trouble ever with the social media piece of it. Because I'm not. I don't spend that much time on those pieces. But because I can work from my phone now. I can answer emails from my phone now. I can upload videos, edit that. I can do everything on this phone. I can sit without having to get up and do anything for hours at a time.

Chris Gibson:
And I have really. I have set alarms in my phone. Good idea to go off to go. You need to move. And I have.. my Fitbit's not on today, but I have that. That also just the same thing. You need to get up, move. So.

Chris Gibson:
Because time just goes by when you're focused.

Jennifer Norman:
Oh, yeah. You spent that much time just scrolling or doing your work or checking emails or texts or whatnot.

Chris Gibson:
It is weird when you're on the... A laptop or desktop, it's different because you realize you're at a desk and you'll get up, but your phone, you're in your easy chair, you're on the couch, the TV, whatever. You're distracted, you're relaxed, and you're doing this. Yeah. And then the tech neck thing. I'm a real, you know, I'm like, I don't want that. I don't have it at 61.

Chris Gibson:
My neck is in really good shape. Somebody just said that on the video from yesterday before. Your neck looks really good for your age. I'm like, I'm like, you guys comment on the weirdest stuff. But.

Jennifer Norman:
Okay, thank you.

Chris Gibson:
But the video that caused all the controversy on my channel, when I talked about my age the first time at 56 was a neck video. I was talking about how to keep this looking good. And yeah.

Jennifer Norman:
Because you. If you're wearing sunscreen, a lot of people forget about the neck.

Chris Gibson:
Yeah. And then it's like I talked about the fact that I was good with that. Talked about the fact that I did facial yoga, hands... Yep. And that I used good products and it kept it hydrated and protected. And it. No matter where you are, just doing those things would make an improvement. And so people started watching that.

Chris Gibson:
That video blew up because people were watching that one because I'm on the thumbnail showing that. And with my age underneath me, 56. And you're like. And some of those folks are never satisfied. I put my password on the thing. I was not going to put my address and my driver's license up on the Internet. I'm not doing that. So I'm like, you can go find me.

Chris Gibson:
You get public records. It's easy to prove all this. But then that group, that hard nosed group about it goes, well, then you've had work done. You get them convinced of one thing and then it's some other reason that it can't be so. So it's like I let that go.

Jennifer Norman:
Go.

Chris Gibson:
I'm like, I help enough people that that makes me happy for sure. My YouTube, my YouTube channel viewers are really, really good. I would say 99.9% of the comments are usually, how helpful. They're not always super positive. They're constructive or they're positive or they're helpful to someone else. Rarely do I get a troll.

Jennifer Norman:
Uhhuh.

Chris Gibson:
And they disappear.

Jennifer Norman:
Right. Right.

Chris Gibson:
Bye.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
Yeah. Because my goal is for not anybody to be intimidated. Body positivity. I do a lot of. On Instagram, there are a lot of thirst traps of me. I just did a whole thing for a fitness brand. Shirtless, which at 61...

Chris Gibson:
Somebody just wrote. Somebody just saw one of the ads and wrote me and said, I hate your guts. Because we're the same age. We've known each other since we were in our teens. He goes, you make me sick. Like, he goes, how do you look like that? They're like, thanks. Always kidding. But yeah, we did a photo shoot.

Chris Gibson:
Even the guys that were. Because I work out, like, I have my peloton, I have my weights. I do have. When I got this place, I made sure I had a room for gym because I don't like the public gym, just because I don't like waiting. And I have a very limited amount of time available. And now that people know who I am, I have no peace when I'm there. Once someone figures out who I am, it's like. So I go every once in a while with my friends.

Chris Gibson:
I'll go and do the treadmill there. But I have all that here. But I'm very consistent with that is the point. So that's what I told the photographers. I said, I am constantly working on myself. Like, I use stretches, I have the peloton. I take the classes, I work out, I try to get outside.

Chris Gibson:
It's Florida. I moved here for a reason, so I could be outside more of the year.

Jennifer Norman:
Right.

Chris Gibson:
Because I spent almost 30 years in Pennsylvania. Beautiful place. Miss parts of it, but I do not miss winter.

Jennifer Norman:
Right.

Chris Gibson:
Coming up. You had that dark period from like Thanksgiving until like Easter killed me. I mean, I grew up in Texas in the sun. So when I moved up, there was a novelty because the trees would turn, it would snow. That five years of that, I was like, you shovel that stuff. I'm not doing it anymore. But it was a good chapter. But I'm happy to be somewhere where I can be outside.

Chris Gibson:
And I take advantage of that. I get out, I try to eat outside, I try to be outside.

Jennifer Norman:
Well, I think that that's so healthy, too, is just to not be sitting inside in a dark room. It is fresh air, artificial light for most of your day. Get outside, see the nature, see the water.

Chris Gibson:
You're clinically depressed, I'm not a doctor. I'm not trying to, but I know for me, like, everybody's a little bit clinically depressed. And because we get roped into stuff, usually because of stuff we can't control, there is nothing better than going out and just turning everything off and sitting outdoors on a nice day with the tree, just. Just being out of that whole thing and go, oh, this is what being a human is about.

Jennifer Norman:
Exactly. Stop watching the news.

Chris Gibson:
Yeah.

Jennifer Norman:
I'm curious because you wrote your book after you had your experience of this amazing transformation from having cystic acne, from discovering holistic medicine and what we would call holistic medicine, and then you decided to become an, like a licensed esthetician for a period of time. Was that because you felt like you had more to offer in terms of. Yeah, yeah. You wanted to learn as well as to continue to help people from a more professional way.

Chris Gibson:
I wanted to formulate skincare products was the big driver, and I knew that to do that, I needed to know a lot more than what I do.

Jennifer Norman:
Got it. Got it.

Chris Gibson:
Surprisingly, that's always trained. You're never done. Oh, you know, you're never finished. You're never done. There's never a time when you go, well, I'm learned all I can learn. I'm just going to do this. So I don't do in office stuff anymore. I do visit spas and wellness centers here and I do treatments with them.

Chris Gibson:
I like, will try stuff out.

Jennifer Norman:
Sure.

Chris Gibson:
My advice, like on some of the new technology, which is a lot of fun, I have got two more videos coming out on some of the new stuff. That's just insane. But it's easier for me to stay in touch with the studies and the information. Not doing that and then providing that information, like on YouTube and through my online community and what have you, and encouraging people to see their dermatologist, like, that's a good thing to do. Mine was amazing. Because a dermatologist, a medically trained, licensed dermatologist can sit you down, and they're able to help you understand your skin's unique needs. And everybody's a little bit different.

Chris Gibson:
Like, for some people, retin A, tretinoin works extremely well. Other people can't put it anywhere near their skin. So to go get a baseline visit where they look at you, make sure you have any skin cancers. This is a really good thing, you know, you get. And it's not that expensive. It's a couple hundred bucks. They can tell your skin type.

Chris Gibson:
They can tell your moisture levels. They can use the sun device on you to see where you have damage that you may not even see yet. And they can prescribe things both over the counter and prescription that can keep you from looking a thousand years old when that stuff starts to pop up. So I'm very big encourager of that all the time. Yeah, people do send me stuff. I'm like, you need to go to the doctor. Thanks, but that's a little personal. And you need to take that to the doctor.

Jennifer Norman:
It's like, what should I do about this wart down here? It's like, okay, didn't need to see that.

Chris Gibson:
Dr. Mike did a whole thing of that. And I wanted to send him an email. Go, do you get... You talked about the holistic way to treat moles and warts and stuff. I have a video on that. And suddenly everybody's wanting to talk about down south with that. I'm like, that is not my job.

Chris Gibson:
Go to see your doctor. These things will work. You gotta, you know, if you got a wart on your hand, you can actually do the baking soda and castor oil with a band aid thing will get rid of it. A piece of duct tape, because you're smothering the virus in there, you know.

Jennifer Norman:
And I've heard people, like, tying strings or a piece of hair...

Chris Gibson:
Oh, no. For skin tags. Because I don't know why anybody would do that.

Jennifer Norman:
Like, I'm like, oh, you can literally...

Chris Gibson:
Go to your dermatologist or you can go to a medical provider. And they use a laser. It takes two seconds and it's gone. It doesn't even hurt. So, like, why would you go to all that? Bleed all over the place now?

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah, you get sent a lot of stuff. You've been in the industry, you've formulated. I'm curious, what has impressed you? And then on the other side, what has driven you crazy? Like, what is like, something like you're like, oh, I wish I didn't see this anymore.

Chris Gibson:
Oh, there's a lot of that.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah, yeah.

Chris Gibson:
Especially with TikTok. What really gets me crazy is when people put stuff out and they're having people put corrosive material on their skin, like toothpaste or lemon juice or grape juice or anything like that.

Jennifer Norman:
Like the 'TikTok made me do it' kind of things.

Chris Gibson:
Yeah, that drives me crazy because people get hurt. You can get a really bad case of dermatitis from something and that is no fun. That's three to six weeks for that to clear up for most folks and a trip to the doctor.

Jennifer Norman:
So I know Ryan Seacrest was a proponent. He was a proponent of that because he was a Crest spokesperson for a while. And he's like, oh, yeah, if I get a zit I put toothpaste on my skin. He was actually one that had a lot of people doing that.

Chris Gibson:
Yeah, don't do that. So that stuff makes me crazy. I think the two most exciting things for me so far have been the use of red light therapy. Getting it out of sports medicine and into the skincare arena, where it actually does do a lot of good things for a lot of folks. I'm a big believer in that technology used consistently. It can be very helpful. Been around for a long time. People don't know that sports medicine, how do you think they got those coupled players off the field and back out in two weeks? So that was part of that therapy.

Chris Gibson:
So I like that that's available to people in the home now. And then the stuff that's with the electromagnetic, minute energy, radio frequency, all of those non invasive ways to help build collagen back in the skin. That's really exciting to see. Human studies come out and show that it actually works. There was a lot of controversy over that. I mean there's. It seems like there's something new every day when it comes to skincare products. I was baffled with the word that hyaluronic acid became a thing.

Chris Gibson:
I'm like, right? I'm like, how did you guys take something that has been around for ages, your skin produces anyway and turn it into a specialized product?

Jennifer Norman:
Companies charge for it too.

Chris Gibson:
I'm like, it's hyaluronic acid. That's a basic component of most moisturizing creams. And then you know what happened? We had the hyaluronic acid. So it was a... Yeah, the hyaluronic acid serums came out and then suddenly they were going, I tried using that one. Sounds awful. But where do you live? And they're like oh I'm in Phoenix. Or I'm like, you can't use hyaluronic acid serum in Phoenix.

Chris Gibson:
It's going to take moisture out of your skin and into the air. You have to use something like polyglutamic acid. Well what is that? So I'd have to explain that they were like that stuff. Amazing. How come I didn't know about that? Because that's been popularized as a one size fits all skincare ingredient. Doesn't work. It's got to be combined with other stuff. So that was very baffling to me.

Chris Gibson:
You know. And then I knew when they started just providing the serum. A hyaluronic acid serum.

Jennifer Norman:
Sure.

Chris Gibson:
Yeah. That's not going to go well. So what I've also I was excited to see brands like The Ordinary and Good Molecules make these, these very, very limited ingredient formulas.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah. Like single ingredient things.

Chris Gibson:
Yeah. That were really great and made them affordable for folks. The caveat being that people have to know how to use them to use them properly. So I spend a lot, a lot of time on my videos when I'm talking about those products explaining how to use them and what to expect effect. And then I another focus is individuals skin chemistry. Like not everything is going to work the same verbal. I've spent money on some serums that are a car payment for some people. Like I won't mention any names because I won't bash brands.

Chris Gibson:
I won't do that. But I spent $300 on a serum that was supposedly Oprah loves this serum, what have you. She was they, they didn't really market it like she's telling you to use it. She loves it. So I like I'm going to try this in my own money. I'm going to try this. Nothing. Didn't get anything out of it. And there are some, another maddening.

Chris Gibson:
There are some skin care ingredients that, like exosomes and...

Jennifer Norman:
I was just going to ask you about your take on exosomes.

Chris Gibson:
That's the other one I can't take this right now. Anyway. Molecular skincare. We'll go with that.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah. What is your take on exosomes?

Chris Gibson:
You have to get the real thing. It's a prescription version. It's going to stimulate stem cells and all that. You're going to have to get a prescription version. Does it help? I think some. I've tried it. I got off of tretinoin which worked well for me and switched over the exosomes and have my skin looks just as good as it did on the tretinoin without irritation. Problem with me and tretinoin is if it migrates to my eyelids, we're done.

Chris Gibson:
My eyelids will peel for a week.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah, yeah. That desquamation is for real.

Chris Gibson:
Yeah. I was putting Vaseline on my eyelids to keep that from getting over because it'll migrate even if you don't touch your eyes. Just the oils in your skin will pull it along and kind of move it around. So I would say for me, the prescription, now I tried the plant based version, you can get over the counter. It didn't do anything for me.

Jennifer Norman:
Hydrating, you can get stuff for like 20 bucks.

Chris Gibson:
Yeah, it's hydrating, but you still know the difference. Ones that are prescription are not plant based. Those are molecular formulations that are designed to activate components of the mitochondria in your cell. It's at a cellular level, type of thing. So while plant... There's nothing wrong with plant exosomes. They're going to be very hydrating and they're good for your skin, but they're not going to. I would say they're not active anytime.

Chris Gibson:
You have to get some of the prescription.

Jennifer Norman:
So from your perspective, it's more marketing.

Chris Gibson:
It's more marketing.

Jennifer Norman:
Okay.

Chris Gibson:
So I mean, the science behind it's the same, but what you're getting...

Jennifer Norman:
But if it's not bioavailable, then it's not working. Yeah, it's kind of like collagen that you put on your skin.

Chris Gibson:
That's. Yeah, I battled that one too. I battled that one in reverse because I'm a big believer in collagen. Peptides, amino acids, you need.

Jennifer Norman:
Right, right, right.

Chris Gibson:
So when I would do them. Well, I read that collagen doesn't work because you put on your skin. It doesn't. It's too big, you know, like the whole thing. And I'm like, we're not talking about collagen, we're talking about amino acids. Your skin knows how to use those. Your skin will absorb those. And they're good in your diet anyway.

Chris Gibson:
And so I. One of the things in the skincare line, one of the things in the supplement line that we're working on is a collagen gummy that's combined with vitamin C already. So that because you need vitamin C, you need to be good on your vitamin C in your diet to have collagen. Peptide amino acids work well to be effective, to be as effective. So. And that's what I mean. The marketing sells it one way and it gets it in people's hands and it gets Then they're like, now what? Now what do I do? What should I expect? So people are expecting to take the collagen peptides and have 30 year old skin within like eight weeks. So I did a video on that.

Chris Gibson:
I took collagen peptides for eight weeks. I'd never taken them in my diet before. Here's what I noticed after eight weeks. And then I followed up again, you know, three months later. So were there benefits? Yeah. Visible benefits? Yeah. But they didn't happen overnight. So we're all, everybody's trained for like quick fixes and fast results and, and I spend a lot of time trying to educate people on.

Chris Gibson:
You've got to give something 90 days. Really you might get...

Jennifer Norman:
28 days at least...

Chris Gibson:
And then you might get lucky and be one of those people that uses a dark spot correcting serum. And those melanin patches are very surfacey and they go away. But what people don't realize, a lot of these are rooted deeply into layers of your skin and it's going to take a while for that to go away. So they're not patient enough with a lot of things when it comes to that. So I try to work on that with folks a lot, just be patient. And then the other thing I battle is everybody wants to buy everything I review. Whatever I talk about, they get it. I'm like, why would you do that? My channel, where in the video, you need to buy this.

Chris Gibson:
That's rare that I say you need to get this. I don't ever say that.

Jennifer Norman:
Really. There's nothing that you're like, run out and get this.

Chris Gibson:
There have been a few, there have been a few that work well for me if this is a good price and a good product that way that I'll get excited over. But in general, I review a lot of products for their ingredients and what you should expect. And people think just because I'm reviewing, I always give the positive benefits and the time frames. So there are some folks that will buy everything. Try to buy every single thing I review. Why would you do that? Do you have a moisturizer that works well and you're happy with it? Yeah. Then why would you, why would you change it or at least wait till you run out try that one.

Chris Gibson:
Because you're just replacing it and it's like, I can't afford to buy all this stuff you talk about. Well, you're not supposed to. When you walk into any place, drugstore, Sephora, Ulta, wherever. If you go in a place that has a lot of skincare do you want to try everything off the shelf? No, but we're all just brainwashed. We need to buy that. That's the latest thing. We need to buy that. We need to have that.

Chris Gibson:
We need to have that. I try to balance that out with folks too.

Jennifer Norman:
Sure, sure. So you mentioned The Ordinary, you mentioned a couple other brands. Are there others that you're like, okay, these guys really, they're pretty solid. They know what they're doing. They really take the ingredients to the next level and they're like the tried and true for you?

Chris Gibson:
I liked One Skin, it's fairly expensive. I like their approach, their molecular approach to skincare, cellular molecular approach. They're different. But the problem with some of these and why it's hard for me to answer that question is that you still need like you still need a vitamin C serum with some of these. Like you can't just use that and only it because you're going to be missing out like it doesn't have the antioxidants agents that say a vitamin C would give you for your skin. Yeah, big believer in vitamin C serum.

Jennifer Norman:
For folks, and actually that this is a good segue, vitamin C. You can't just buy any vitamin C serum because there's a lot of hokiness around that too. Can you just provide like maybe like a one minute education on what kind of vitamin C you should look for?

Chris Gibson:
You try some vitamin C, L ascorbic acid, which is unstable, it's very strong, very effective, but not good for everybody's skin type unless it's a very low percentage. So it's hard sometimes to determine how much that percentage is.2 to 5% is probably, probably good for most people because again, this is an ongoing serum. You're not trying to really cure anything. You're just trying to help your skin be healthy. The vitamin C, if you have sensitive skin, then there's sodium ascorbyl phosphate, which is stable. It's a derivative, gives the similar result longer time to work. So none of those should ever cost you more than 50 bucks. You just don't need a super powered vitamin C serum.

Chris Gibson:
And there's a brand out there that has been well known for years of being super expensive. I'm not gonna name the name. But now they come out with, well, our patent expired so we're able to lower our price now. They had a patent on vitamin C serum and ferulic acid. Really? I mean, so, so yeah. So if you want a good vitamin C serum, the best is a serum that has ferulic acid because it supports the vitamin C action. And that can be in either one of those, the L ascorbic or the sodium ascorbyl phosphate. But if you have sensitive skin, you want to do the sodium ascorbyl phosphate version, not the other, because it's reactive.

Chris Gibson:
Same sort of problem with that as with tretinoin versus an over the counter retinol. Retinoic acid is actually better than both on your skin because it doesn't go through that chemical change at all. So I'm sure the people that make the tretinoin products aren't happy with that. And again, if someone was using tretinoin and they agreed with them and they've got great results, why change? Mm, just leave it alone. It's working. Long term. Tretinoin use for a lot of people that started already has paid way more benefits than people that did Botox, because we have all the issues that we're around too much Botox use for too long. So yeah, that vitamin C serum, I think everybody should give that a go.

Chris Gibson:
It's really good for your skin. It's. Think of it as food for your skin.

Jennifer Norman:
Yep.

Chris Gibson:
So vitamin C in the diet, vitamin C on the outside of your skin helps protect against damage from the sun. There's no reason not to use it unless your skin is reactive. And that's usually to the L score because acid version, which by the way, after you open the bottle, six to eight weeks later it starts to lose its. Even in a dark bottle. We've done, we've done the test strip, maybe we've done the test strips. It does the strength. Yeah. Once the air starts getting to it, they'll buy small ones.

Jennifer Norman:
Small ones. Or if you can get like an airless sort of a package, then that typically helps to keep its potency.

Chris Gibson:
No, we have strips. I have strips I can insert and stuff and tell the strengths of activate. You could do that? Of course you can. That's what the test, that's what the consumer people do to make sure that's how they. Well, it wasn't a strip, but that's how they caught the skin care that.

Jennifer Norman:
They're not giving the potency that they're supposedly.

Chris Gibson:
That's the same thing that happened with the sunscreens a few years ago. Remember sunscreens, 50 SPF. It wasn't even close. So it's like, yeah, yeah. But yeah, vitamin C serum is good, but a lot of people don't realize they'll try to get three or four bottles of that stuff cheaper. Just buy the little one or like I said in airless dark bottle and use it. Vitamin E is also good if you can find one that has vitamin E in it and just use it every morning and it's just going to feed your skin. It's going to help your skin and it helps your other products work better too.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah, yeah. It's a really good foundation. I mean you don't have to spend a whole lot on your cleanser. Your cleanser is your cleanser and it washes down the drain. So people will think that they need a fancy cleanser. It's really not. Don't put your money there, put it on your leave ons. And so let's talk about sunscreen since I know that that's where your controversy seemed to have started.

Jennifer Norman:
And it's so funny because having worked so many years for Neutrogena and having worked on their sun business and really knowing what the ingredients are and you know, the mineral, the zinc and the titaniums versus the, your oxybenzones and your, the chemical based ones, and then hearing the controversy from moms saying 'I'm never using sunscreen again, it causes autism' or 'it causes vitamin D deficiency' or 'it causes cancer' and all of that. And I was like, you know, it just really took me aback.

Chris Gibson:
It baffled you, didn't it? Baffled you?

Jennifer Norman:
Baffled. It baffled me, Chris. It baffled me.

Chris Gibson:
Yeah. Sunscreen. I've done a ton of videos on sunscreens. Probably time for me to do another one because we're having this time of year where people quit using it because.

Jennifer Norman:
Exactly. Because they think, oh, I don't need sunscreen in the wintertime or like...

Chris Gibson:
Okay. The biggest problem with the chemical sunscreens happens in the ocean, really. Not on your skin. So when you take a look at the new generation. Yeah. So that's a good thing. So there's specific sunscreens you should wherever you're going to be in the ocean water just to protect the marine life. What folks understand is when they test these chemicals out, they test on a huge strength.

Chris Gibson:
I mean it's not even the same amount that would go on your skin. It's in a petri dish. And they look how cells react, living cells react to those ingredients.

Jennifer Norman:
This is called in vitro.

Chris Gibson:
Yeah. So there's some concerns with some of what they saw with avobenzone and octinoxate. Those are the two that the biggest concerns. So no human has gotten cancer from sunscreen. I have researched and researched this till I have fallen off the chair. There's not a, no one has been, that's not been tied to any cancer death. Skin cancer has. Skin cancer has been tied to a lot of deaths from not using it.

Chris Gibson:
So then you've got the minerals and then you got nano and non nano. That controversy.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah, yeah.

Chris Gibson:
And I'm like, look folks, you need to wear sunscreen. Whatever kind you'll wear is the kind you should get because we have all these beautiful hybrids now where they've taken as little of the chemical one version as you would need for protection and they've added mineral sunscreen to it for extra protection. So you're getting really good sunscreen with minerals. They wipe off, they sweat off really quickly. So your clothes wear them off. So I mean if you're not going to wear sunscreen, you need to wear sun protective clothing and a hat if you're going to be out all day now you run into the car to get something out, a little bit of sunlight. I tell people a little morning light, little evening light is good for you. Yeah, good for you.

Chris Gibson:
But if you're going to be outside working in the yard all day or baking at the beach, you need to be protected. So I go round and round with it and I just try to tell people like you've got. There's so many varieties now from pure zinc all the way over to our, well, they're not even the same generation anymore because they've changed all those formulations that are going to protect your skin. At least 15. 50 is not necessary. 50 is heavy. Gets in people's eyes.

Chris Gibson:
They get fooled into thinking I put a 50 on, I'm going all day. Which is another myth.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah, the compliance is like, yeah, you've got to be able to know that you either need to reapply it or... I mean, I think women have a little bit of a benefit in that a lot of us like to wear makeup, and so makeup has built in sunscreens because of the minerals and the titanium and whatnot.

Chris Gibson:
But I tell people, here's what I do and I'm still kicking. So I wear sunscreen. I wear. If I'm going to go to the beach, I wear a beach appropriate sunscreen that is chemically based that won't sweat or wash off quickly. My general sunscreen, I love Dermatology brand for their SPF 46. I have a tinted one and a clear one. I use the tinted one on my face just so I don't have that kind of white shiny that's on my face.

Chris Gibson:
But I use the plain one on my arms, my neck, anything that's exposed. And I don't have 61 year old skin or what people would think of as. I don't get skin tears, I don't have bruising, I don't have the spots all over. I have a few spots where the melanin has stopped because that ran out as you get older. You just run out. It's like right here you just run out of color.

Jennifer Norman:
Just run out of color.

Chris Gibson:
I don't have a lot red, green, blue, yellow, brown looking stuff. And which by the way, if you have that sun damage, it can be repaired. I mean there are formulations now that have kojic acid, hydroquinone and a bit of a retinol that really reverse that.

Jennifer Norman:
I use the Triluma knockoff from Musely.

Chris Gibson:
Yeah.

Jennifer Norman:
And it works great.

Chris Gibson:
Yeah. Musely has a real... That body formula is amazing. I've seen what that does. I use it myself.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah. I use the spot product and it works really well.

Chris Gibson:
It's funny. The reason I got into that was I had a few spots pop up and I started using Versed Skincare's gentle retinol bakuchiol instead of the retinol. Yeah.

Jennifer Norman:
It's the natural retinol.

Chris Gibson:
My arms were responding to that.

Jennifer Norman:
Oh good.

Chris Gibson:
I was like that's an over the counter product that costs $11 able to do that. When I found out that there was the one. Because I know the acids are kogic acid, tranexamic acid. When I found out there was a compounded formulation that included hydroquinone. I wanted it. That's a really good ingredient. You can't get over counter anymore because people abused it.

Jennifer Norman:
Of course that was another controversial ingredient. Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
But it works really well. And what they generally do is they have you use it for a while with the hydroquinone.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
They have you use it without it. I've never had any problems with it. And it's such a small dosage of that anyway. And it's compounded to work with the other ingredients. So it's not the main one. But I was telling people even turmeric soap.

Jennifer Norman:
Oh, interesting.

Chris Gibson:
It works really, really well. Especially for other areas of the body where you have just discoloration from friction and age the armpits growing all those areas. That soap is very mild.

Jennifer Norman:
Wow.

Chris Gibson:
Melanin is a brand I really like. I have it in the shower. The Yellow bar soap. And for guys, because we tend to get that darkening in the skin here. Everybody knows those areas. So that soap works really well. You just soap up. You leave it on for a couple minutes and rinse it off.

Chris Gibson:
If I do that, it's those areas lighten back up to their normal pigmentation.

Jennifer Norman:
Very cool.

Chris Gibson:
Because it's not like an age spot. That's a friction pigmentation issue. Almost like a scar.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
So the skin on the surfaces has darkened because it's tougher, rougher to protect you. So really good stuff. So it doesn't always have to be an extra product. That bar stuff, I think is five bucks. So now that's, watch. That's the next trend. Because now I'm seeing the ads everywhere.

Jennifer Norman:
Hit subscribe right now for more stories and inspiring conversations with me, Jennifer Norman, the host of The Human Beauty Movement Podcast.

Jennifer Norman:
Isn't it amazing how on TikTok people are so intrigued by extractions? I can't help myself.

Chris Gibson:
I'm like, I am. I have a peer. This is much like what I was worried was going to happen to me on the YouTube channel. I did a mole and wart video. We talked about that. Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
And it took off. Off. Because it was a holistic approach to that. And the warts were using baking soda and castor oil to kill the wart virus because people were almost a virus and they're replicating. So that took off and I thought, great, I'm going to be known as the wart guy on YouTube. I have a peer that has a good skincare channel and he's about 800,000 people. He passed me. We're kind of in a little mutual challenge.

Chris Gibson:
He had a video that he did on extraction. A YouTube short. It's gross. He said, I just did it just to have it in the kind of the catalog like to say I could. I did one on that and the thing went viral and gave him all these subscribers that do nothing. They don't watch the other videos. So he goes, it's not as much. It's not as grand as it looks. Because, you know, people are fascinated with that.

Chris Gibson:
That's what they're fascinated with. They don't want to know about this brand or this new ingredient or this formulation works better or rankings or any of. They don't want any of that. All they want is that stuff. So he had a choice to make. Either keep making that stuff and grow a channel. I'd be about that. Or stick to my skin care.

Chris Gibson:
And he stuck to the skin care smart guy. So I was like, just stick to that. Because is that really what you Want to do? Dr. Pimple Popper has that. Let her have that.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah, she's, you know, she's quite the celebrity nowadays.

Chris Gibson:
Let her have all that squishy wishy stuff. As a person, that skin problems. I don't like to look at it at all. Oh, I'm just like the poor person.

Jennifer Norman:
It's one of those strangely intriguing. What do they call it? It's like just very, very odd. Like you find yourself like.

Chris Gibson:
I get the psychology of it. It's like videos where people. People want to. If I do something on food, they want to see me eat it. I get the psychology of all that. But I'm just like, would you watch people get their teeth ripped out? Like that's an extraction.

Jennifer Norman:
Some people might. Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
Well, somebody told me there's something for everybody.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
Because they're like, you should do so they were jokingly when I did the photo shoot, you should do only fans. I'm like, nobody wants to see me at 61 and I would never do that anyway. And then they're like, what are we going to do? Wiggle my toes? I go, oh, you probably make a lot of money with that. Do people like that? Really wiggling toes?

Jennifer Norman:
Really? Really? Oh, I guess there's something for everyone.

Chris Gibson:
Not happening. So nobody get excited because I'm not doing that.

Jennifer Norman:
Oh, wow.

Chris Gibson:
My videos are YouTube friendly.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
So made for TV.

Jennifer Norman:
Were there like a couple of videos that you think were like, really responsible for you getting the most subscribers that you've had? Because you've got a really healthy channel. You've got over a half a million subscribers now and counting.

Chris Gibson:
And my subscriber base is interesting because it skewed older once I started focusing on anti aging or pro aging. So. But I still have people who've been following me from the book days that were in their 20s, teens and 20s, that are now in their 40s.

Jennifer Norman:
Right.

Chris Gibson:
The neck video took off. I've done the yoga video took off. This facial yoga video took off. It was been very. It's just not been any one sort of thing. Now that I did do a video on Under Eye Bags Gone in two minutes. It was the baking soda and water version where you just. You mix them and you.

Chris Gibson:
Because the baking soda helps extract the lymph fluid. So if that's a lymph fluid problem, not straight on baking soda because it can be a little challenging. That video took off because I think the title was how to get rid of eye bags in under two minutes and I do it on screen. I use it. That one was for a long time that one took off. But on my channel it's weird stuff that I have done a year or two ago that was all right. We'll suddenly get life like somebody will watch it all the way through and recommend it. It'll get some other channel mention it.

Chris Gibson:
And now I've got a big YouTube video that I've got to go back and update everything on because now people are seeing it. So I will tell you what overall has been the English popular are skincare oils talking about frankincense and myrrh and castor oil. Of course. Castor oil had a new life on TikTok not too long ago. But anytime I do oil videos, people pay attention.

Jennifer Norman:
I'm going to send you some of my Humanist Beauty Facial Oil then.

Chris Gibson:
There you go. You might as well send it to me. I like oils because they work well skin understand the oil because we produce it, all those things and for a lot of people it's in their budget and it can give them some really good results as long as they patch test, make sure they don't have any irritation to that oil. Like lavender oil gives me problems and that's in a lot of stuff.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
So I. It's one of those that gives me a little issue. Not if it's mixed with something, but if I put lavender oil, even with a carrier oil on, my skin doesn't like it. Oh, but bakuchiol oil I just did. We just did on a product release for the retinol alternative that has bakuchiol in it and people went wild over that. They I'm like, it's a good stuff. I mean it worked for you. You're not going to get red, dry and peely from it.

Jennifer Norman:
And for those that like more natural type ingredients.

Chris Gibson:
Right. And a lot of people are looking for that that they don't want a lot of things they don't understand on the label or a lot of artificial fragrance. The great thing about the oils is they have a fragrance that's naturally aromatherapic to them. Yeah. So you're getting something that smells nice but without artificial chemical perfume in it. So people like that. So those have been by and far, I would say as a trend over the last six, eight months. Those have been the videos that have been really, really liked a lot.

Jennifer Norman:
So what is next for you?

Chris Gibson:
Big question. I got a new book. A new book needs to come out.

Jennifer Norman:
A new book needs to come out.

Chris Gibson:
Yeah.

Jennifer Norman:
Are you working on it?

Chris Gibson:
I started putting it there. I made a promise in the early days on the channel when I got to 500,000 subscribers, I'd start working on the book whenever that was. And I said the reason I was very honest. Having been in the book business and done a book before, I'm not doing a book unless it's a bestseller. So the only way to guarantee that is to have another you bought. But it's going to be good. So there got to be enough of you guys willing to do that. So I started working on it.

Chris Gibson:
It's probably a couple years for books are hard even with. I'm not going to chat gbt. I'm not going to do that. I mean that's great for research, but it cannot write your book for you. People will know. But the great thing for me is I have 1600 videos now.

Jennifer Norman:
Wow.

Chris Gibson:
Catalog of videos, catalog of information that I can pull from to help me write the book, which I does not all have to be in my head at once. I can say I want to talk about this topic and go to my own videos and rewatch them and go and be reminded of all that information. So that's helpful. I have a small skincare line we've been developing. It's. We just added. Added a product, a bakuchiol product for... It's called First Row Retinol Alternative.

Chris Gibson:
It's a really good product. Botanical based, organic, botanically based, vegan, all that stuff.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah. And when do your supplements come out?

Chris Gibson:
So we're working on that now. That's been a wild ride. So I picked out a supplement. We got it, got the label design. It's good. I have it here in the house. I've tried it.

Chris Gibson:
I was about to have friends buy it and then the supplier for that said we're having global issues going on getting the ingredients. So we're going to discontinue that and replace it with a different formula which would be fine. Haven't launched yet. Not a big deal. Except they don't know when that formula is going to be available. So now I got to go to a different supplier and find a formulation that they'll adjust for me to my specifications so that we can release it. So we have other stuff coming. But it was like I was not pleased.

Chris Gibson:
I was pleased that we didn't launch it yet.

Jennifer Norman:
The behind the scenes of product development, ladies and gents, is it's difficult.

Jennifer Norman:
There's always so many moving parts.

Chris Gibson:
So, you know, we just went through the whole approval process with the merchant accounts to sell it and all that. So it's fine. Like I said, the universe is usually very protective of me. And as I said to my business, I said, well, look, we were about to launch this. What if we had launched it and then when it had it in November?

Jennifer Norman:
Exactly. Hey, it would have been happened for a reason beforehand.

Chris Gibson:
So at least we didn't do that yet. I mean, we've done all the work to get it on the website and all that was it sort of like. I look at it this way, sometimes I film a video and I think it's great. It looked good. I did everything right. The sound check. For whatever reason, the microphone came unplugged or something happened or there's no sound.

Jennifer Norman:
Oh, it's so frustrating.

Chris Gibson:
And I have to redo the whole thing.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
And I'm like, it's never. I always feel like it's never as good as that one. It's always one where I'm thinking that's really good. And not a lot of outtakes, not a lot of language in there because I get frustrated when things interrupt me. Except for the dogs, which they've been really good. There's two of them.

Jennifer Norman:
I didn't even know that they were there.

Chris Gibson:
They have been really good. Emma's a little bit famous because she gets. Gets cameoed occasionally, but the other one doesn't like the camera. But they've been really good. It's dinner time and they're like, I'm amazed.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah. Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
Never barked in anything. It's like, wow. So. But yeah, supplements I'm doing. And the reason I'm doing that stuff is because it's an extension of what I'm doing on YouTube already. It's stuff that I use. I'm not going to sell anything that I'm not using myself. So that makes.

Chris Gibson:
That keeps me my finger on the pulse of the product and how it's working. And then I have a certain level of trust I want to preserve with my viewing audience. So they've known about it. I don't push it on the channel hard, but they knew about it. I did not want to make the mistakes of some of my peers of like sending stuff out and not telling them. I won't name names that it was theirs. Nothing wrong with doing that. To get the thought process was, I'm going to send this out, I want feedback and I don't want people to tell me what I want to hear.

Chris Gibson:
I want people to tell me if it's good or not. So they did that. That. Well, then it came out. It got started, as it always does in the Internet world, that, oh well, that's their product. They're selling you their product and they just didn't want you to know. So that took off and caused a lot of problems for that person. So I'm just like, nothing intentional.

Chris Gibson:
The products are great and they've recovered. They're doing just fine. But I said, I'm learning from that.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
Because I get the logic. You're the personality behind. So I get the logic. I want people to test that without knowing that it's me behind it. So I get true feedback. Didn't work out that way. So I'm like, yeah, I'm not going to do that. So I had people know and I tell them, just come back and let me know how it works.

Chris Gibson:
And it's not at retail or any. We weren't doing that. That person took over retail. It was a really big thing for that. Have that kind of rumor get out was not a good thing. So we're just building it along kind of like Paula's Choice did. Just kind of organically going there when the right time, when it's time for it to be in a retail shop, it'll be in a retail shop. Until then, skincare company has it and we just keep developing and get feedback.

Chris Gibson:
And that's why I like to do things. That's what happened with the book. The skincare book was an ebook. The Acne Free was an ebook on Clickbank because Amazon wasn't selling books yet and it took off. So we knew it was hitting a nerve. So spent a year getting feedback from people who read the ebook and the questions from people that I didn't answer in the book that we revised it. That's when we turned it into a paperback. So it was an ebook, a paperback, then a hardcover.

Chris Gibson:
And I was on TV. So it's completely backwards to what usually works. It's usually a hardcover than the paperback.

Jennifer Norman:
What a great indie way to do it. Rather than like going and diving in with all this investment and all that.

Chris Gibson:
As soon as I got on TV, that all changed.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
First TV show.

Jennifer Norman:
Well, congrats on that.

Chris Gibson:
Great. That was crazy.

Jennifer Norman:
No, that's really, really phenomenal. I really congratulate you for all of that and everything that has been able to happen since then and just, just catalyzing your way forward. It's really, really fantastic to see. Super. super. All right.

Jennifer Norman:
So, Chris, to end, I always ask my guests three constant questions, which are reminders of what connects us all. Our beauty, our humanity, and the truths that we live by. So my first question to you is, what makes you beautiful?

Chris Gibson:
My authenticity. That's easy. I try to keep it real. Real even when it makes me look bad. I'll try to keep it real.

Jennifer Norman:
Even when it makes you look bad. You're still beautiful because you're authentic.

Chris Gibson:
You know what I mean by that? Even if it's exactly like, I shouldn't have done that.

Jennifer Norman:
Huh. Okay. Actually, my second question to you is, what does it mean to be human?

Chris Gibson:
Lots of mistakes. Because you're always learning. Do you really get something right? The first thing out of the gate? Which is why we. We like that. That's why we like that feeling. It's fun when you win. It's fun when you get something right. But usually it takes a lot of.

Chris Gibson:
This is learning. I mean, that's how you grow. It grows you. Was that. What do you go through? Grows you. And we all go through stuff, for sure.

Jennifer Norman:
And my last question for you is, what's one truth that you live by?

Chris Gibson:
One truth. Tell the truth. It really goes with the other one. Be consistent. Tell the truth.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah, those are great.

Chris Gibson:
Those two. Consistency.

Jennifer Norman:
Yeah, those are great answers.

Chris Gibson:
My mama raised me right with that.

Jennifer Norman:
Your mama raised you. Your mama raised you good, Chris.

Chris Gibson:
I have a sibling or two that chose other modus operandi when it came to telling our parents, and I was the one like, you know what? Yep. And, you know, you're a kid. You know why you did it. Nope. Right. Well, you're not grounded. Thank you for telling the truth. And I... Listen. I still get flack about that, dude.

Chris Gibson:
I'm like, I told the truth. Yeah, but you should have gotten a spanking for that. And you didn't. I'm like, no, I didn't get a spanking.

Jennifer Norman:
Because the truth is more important than what you actually did.

Chris Gibson:
When I got in situations later in my life as a teen and I had some dust ups, you know?

Jennifer Norman:
Oh, that's another podcast for sure.

Chris Gibson:
Dust. Dust. In high school, my parents would tell the principal of the school or whoever, I believe him. He doesn't lie. No, he will tell the truth, even if it makes him look bad.

Jennifer Norman:
That's important. Yeah.

Chris Gibson:
Growing up, I was in the corporate world for a little while. That was always. They always believed me because I just. I didn't fib or stretch it or anything.

Jennifer Norman:
You tell it like it is.

Chris Gibson:
Tell it like it is.

Jennifer Norman:
Oh, amazing. Well, nicely done.

Chris Gibson:
It's always important to be nice when you do it.

Jennifer Norman:
Yes. Well Chris, thank you so much. Beautiful humans. Go see Chris on his YouTube channel which is Chris Gibson Live. You will find an emporium of great tips, advice, reviews, all of these things that you want to know and more about skin care, about beauty products, about a holistic lifestyle from inside out. Chris, thank you so much for being my guest today on the podcast. It was such a fun time talking with you.

Chris Gibson:
Yeah, very.

Jennifer Norman:
Thank you for listening to The Human Beauty Movement Podcast. Be sure to follow, rate and review us wherever you stream podcasts. The Human Beauty Movement is a community based platform that cultivates the beauty of humankind. Check out our workshops, find us on social media and share our inspiration with all the beautiful humans in your life. Learn more at thehumanbeautymovement.com. Thank you so much for being a beautiful human.